Anyone else on here both solidly on the left and anti-abortion?

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This very concretely means that I think that abortion is always immoral and in the vast majority of cases should not be legal, with exceptions for rape, incest,conditions that endanger the mother's life or severe disability.

So what is to prevent every woman that wants an abortion from coming in and saying I got raped six weeks ago by a stranger.  She has showered and washed her clothes numerous times since the "attack."  How could you bar her from having an abortion?  This is what the conservatives in America quite effectively and accurately have argued.  I mean if you are willing to have an abortion lying about a rape to a doctor isn't really going to be a big deal.

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I'm firmly on the left, and I think abortion should be totally legal, and I think the stigma against it should be removed.

I'm firmly with you on that.  Well I think there should be a little bit of a stigma involved for the woman and man.  I was just showing belgiansocialist the flaw in his argument.

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I'm firmly on the left, and I think abortion should be totally legal, and I think the stigma against it should be removed.

I'm firmly with you on that.  Well I think there should be a little bit of a stigma involved for the woman and man.  I was just showing belgiansocialist the flaw in his argument.

By stigma, I mean the whole social...thing that leads women to cry and hurt over having gotten an abortion, that also leads many women to not get an abortion at all.

I also think they should be subsidized at least for persons under the age of eighteen.

Whoa!

I think there should be a little bit of a stigma involved≠demonized

Currently women that get abortions are called "baby killers" and they risk being blown up if they go to abortion clinics.  That is not the same as saying, "you kinda screwed up sweetheart, try using a condom next time."  There is a difference. It's subtle... but it is a difference.

If you do much dating you will also realise women cry about things like shoes.  Basing public policy on the off chance a woman somewhere might cry is not effective.

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And no, I don't really care about a fetus' life, honestly. Yes, I think a fetus is a living being, but not a self-aware human being. As long as it doesn't even feel pain, I don't really mind killing it. Of course killing a living being is always a bad thing, but don't we kill animals to eat them, or to make scientific experiences ? Yes, a fetus is a life, but not yet a human being. It deserves some dignity, but not the same we give to full human beings.

And what of the severely mentally handicapped? Are they full human beings? And if they aren't, then should they have less rights than the rest of us? And to what place does that lead us?

I think in general that it's better not to philosophise too much over issues like this. Better to accept the necessity of imperfect and necessarily contradictory compromise.

Depending on how you define "full human being" I would say no.  Frankly we shouldn't pour valuable resources into keeping the severely mentally handicapped alive while entire families are having their homes foreclosed on and being tossed out into the street.  Our priorities in America are completely nonsensical.  I've seen severely mentally handicapped people that don't move, don't speak, who can't even feed themselves be admitted to the hospital time after time and have all kinds of interventions done to prolong their lives.  All at the tax payers expense.  If I were to have severe dementia and a stroke I wouldn't want people to spend hundreds of thousands of dollars to prolong my "life."

The hundreds of thousands of dollar that were used to prolong the "life" of Terri Schiavo were a complete waste.

Frankly I think all Down syndrome babies should be aborted.