The Wisconsin Cheese Showdown

[Gustaf]

Outside economists have estimated a large budget deficit over the next 3 years.

http://www.lafollette.wisc.edu/publications/workingpapers/reschovsky2010-016.pdf

Let me guess: they proposed a series of tax cuts to fix the deficit.

Let me correct you: no they do not. They actually do not give a policy recommendation at all, but simply note that Wisconsin will have to raise taxes and/or cut spending while also noting that it seems likely that spending cuts will  largely reduce services, since there is little room for efficiency gains.

But I guess a troll post was much easier to make than actually looking at the link.

[memphis]

So, the same GOP crowd who spent all of last year screaming that you have to make six figures just to survive in CA and NY is now whining that police and firemen make six figures? Predictable...

[krazen1211]

Walker's policies he put forth as soon as he took over made the deficit much worse. 

By 'much', you mean about 4% over the next 2 fiscal years?

[Landslide Lyndon]

Outside economists have estimated a large budget deficit over the next 3 years.

http://www.lafollette.wisc.edu/publications/workingpapers/reschovsky2010-016.pdf

Let me guess: they proposed a series of tax cuts to fix the deficit.

Let me correct you: no they do not. They actually do not give a policy recommendation at all, but simply note that Wisconsin will have to raise taxes and/or cut spending while also noting that it seems likely that spending cuts will  largely reduce services, since there is little room for efficiency gains.

But I guess a troll post was much easier to make than actually looking at the link.

What's wrong with you man? If you fail to detect sarcasm that doesn't make someone a troll, more likely it means you're a humorless bore.

[Queen Mum Inks.LWC]

... calling in sick when you're not really sick is unnacceptable.  If I did that 3 days in a row and didn't bring in a doctor's note, I'd be fired.

That's terrible.  Where do you work, you poor man?  Some warehouse dock?

At my work I frequently leave for days at a time without telling anyone.  Just show up when I have classes or a meeting. 

Food service department at a historical attraction.

[Gustaf]

Outside economists have estimated a large budget deficit over the next 3 years.

http://www.lafollette.wisc.edu/publications/workingpapers/reschovsky2010-016.pdf

Let me guess: they proposed a series of tax cuts to fix the deficit.

Let me correct you: no they do not. They actually do not give a policy recommendation at all, but simply note that Wisconsin will have to raise taxes and/or cut spending while also noting that it seems likely that spending cuts will  largely reduce services, since there is little room for efficiency gains.

But I guess a troll post was much easier to make than actually looking at the link.

What's wrong with you man? If you fail to detect sarcasm that doesn't make someone a troll, more likely it means you're a humorless bore.

I got the impression that you assumed he was citing Republicans and therefore was being sarcastic about Republicans always wanting tax cuts. I thought that was pretty sloppy.

Regardless, you seem to usually respond to everything with hyperbole which isn't very constructive and this struck me as a good example.

If there was something funny that I missed, my apologies though. I'm far from perfect, but I'm certainly not humourless.

[jimrtex]

In its Jan. 31 memo to legislators on the condition of the state’s budget, the Fiscal Bureau determined that the state will end the year with a balance of $121.4 million.

(snip)_

Here is the document. Enjoy reading.

http://legis.wisconsin.gov/lfb/Misc/2011_01_31Vos&Darling.pdf

Wisconsin requires that a general account balance of $65 million.  So the projected net balance was $56 billion.

But you apparently did not read Page 3, which noted the $153 million shortfall in Medicaid and $22 million in corrections budget just to get through June.

You would also have known about those if you had read the fiscal note for the pending legislation.

And you also ignore the $60 million that Wisconsin owes Minnesota, and the $200 million that Wisconsin illegally transferred from the Patients Compensation Fund in 2007-9.  Read Page 2

[anvi]

I have no objection to the measures regarding increased pension and health plan contributions; the fact that teachers have contributed nothing up to now, and even under this measure still enjoy a very good deal compared to teachers in other states, really does put an unnecessarily heavy strain on the state budget.  The CPI cap seems arbitrary and the ending of collective bargaining is extreme and unnecessary.  The governor claims he wanted to get rid of collective bargaining because the process takes fifteen months, time the budget doesn't have to fix.  But, as noted above, there are other ways around that.

The Wisconsin GOP has spent a lot of money, time and effort building up their organization in the last two years; they have huge majorities in the state legislature, they won the governorship, one U.S. Senate seat and two House seats.  In the midterms, they got big turnarounds from younger voters and women as well as "independents."  But shooting the moon like this is going to mobilize a lot of opposition in 2012 that otherwise may have been lukewarm.  I guess abusing a mandate is just too great a temptation for any group of politicians, no matter which party they represent.

[Beet]

So how much of an idiot is this governor? Now, I am certainly no fan of public employee unions and perhaps they are being coddled in Wisconsin, I am not sure. I have seen his proposals to increase the contributions workers make to their healthcare and pensions and I agree with that. But where things go awry is when he tries to take away collective bargaining rights from the employees.

What does taking away the rights of unions to collect dues have to do with the deficit? What does having to have a yearly vote to keep your union together have to do with the deficit? This moron overreached and it's sad Republicans here can't see that. I also don't like public employee unions, but this bill goes above and beyond just taking away plush benefits from them. Keep the unions in line, but don't take away people's rights to form them.

Right. Just take out that part and this bill would be fine.

[Landslide Lyndon]

In its Jan. 31 memo to legislators on the condition of the state’s budget, the Fiscal Bureau determined that the state will end the year with a balance of $121.4 million.

(snip)_

Here is the document. Enjoy reading.

http://legis.wisconsin.gov/lfb/Misc/2011_01_31Vos&Darling.pdf

Wisconsin requires that a general account balance of $65 million.  So the projected net balance was $56 billion.

But you apparently did not read Page 3, which noted the $153 million shortfall in Medicaid and $22 million in corrections budget just to get through June.

You would also have known about those if you had read the fiscal note for the pending legislation.

And you also ignore the $60 million that Wisconsin owes Minnesota, and the $200 million that Wisconsin illegally transferred from the Patients Compensation Fund in 2007-9.  Read Page 2

So, the budget situation was so grim that Walker's first action was to cut taxes.
Makes sense.

[opebo]

Food service department at a historical attraction.

So how do you survive?  And don't you find your poverty would tend to serve as an argument near-at-hand in favor of unions?

[Beet]

In its Jan. 31 memo to legislators on the condition of the state’s budget, the Fiscal Bureau determined that the state will end the year with a balance of $121.4 million.

(snip)_

Here is the document. Enjoy reading.

http://legis.wisconsin.gov/lfb/Misc/2011_01_31Vos&Darling.pdf

Wisconsin requires that a general account balance of $65 million.  So the projected net balance was $56 billion.

But you apparently did not read Page 3, which noted the $153 million shortfall in Medicaid and $22 million in corrections budget just to get through June.

You would also have known about those if you had read the fiscal note for the pending legislation.

And you also ignore the $60 million that Wisconsin owes Minnesota, and the $200 million that Wisconsin illegally transferred from the Patients Compensation Fund in 2007-9.  Read Page 2

That still doesn't get anywhere near the $3.6 billion that Walker is claiming. It's true that the state probably has a shortfall that large based on projected agency requests for future years, but that report is pretty misleading.

[opebo]

Overtime is part of it. They all call in sick (personal days) at the same time, so the place is "understaffed," and overtime needs to be paid. They take turns. They must have a spreadsheet to manage it all. Overtime is particularly toxic, because their bloated defined benefit plan compensation gets a steroidal boost from playing the overtime game. It is really quite a dirty little nest that they inhabit.

Well its great that they can do that, Torie.  Do you propose that no one may be allowed to be ill?  Or that there be the same hourly pay for persons working over the 40 hour week?  People died in the 1930s fighting for these (incredibly meager) rights..  I'd hate to see them go just because your class wants more golden toilet bowls.

[Beet]

Overtime is part of it. They all call in sick (personal days) at the same time, so the place is "understaffed," and overtime needs to be paid. They take turns. They must have a spreadsheet to manage it all. Overtime is particularly toxic, because their bloated defined benefit plan compensation gets a steroidal boost from playing the overtime game. It is really quite a dirty little nest that they inhabit.

Well its great that they can do that, Torie.  Do you propose that no one may be allowed to be ill?  Or that there be the same hourly pay for persons working over the 40 hour week?  People died in the 1930s fighting for these (incredibly meager) rights..  I'd hate to see them go just because your class wants more golden toilet bowls.

The people in the 1930s died for union rights in the private sector. Unfortunately they were undercut by Alabama, Arizona, Oklahoma and Texas. Wake me up when there's a UAW chapter striking at the Hyundai plant.

[jimrtex]

Did you know the teachers that are striking, calling in sick, whatever, make no contribution to their health or pension plans, zero?  Did you know that what is being proposed is that they pay for 12.5% of their health insurance premiums, and contribute something like 5% of their salary or something to their pension plan?  That is their pay cut. Oh the horror, the horror. Anyone in private industry getting that deal would have an orgasm.

It's about the fact that Wisconsin doesn't even need to be making these cuts, if it wasn't for the GOP's tax breaks.

The cuts are to pay for the Medicaid and corrections shortfall just to get through June.

The tax cuts are on 2011 taxable income and don't come due until 2012.  The major break is to apply the same deduction for Health Savings Accounts that the federal government provides.

[opebo]

The people in the 1930s died for union rights in the private sector. Unfortunately they were undercut by Alabama, Arizona, Oklahoma and Texas. Wake me up when there's a UAW chapter striking at the Hyundai plant.

Actually with free trade with foreign countries the slave South is irrelevant.

[Gustaf]

The people in the 1930s died for union rights in the private sector. Unfortunately they were undercut by Alabama, Arizona, Oklahoma and Texas. Wake me up when there's a UAW chapter striking at the Hyundai plant.

Actually with free trade with foreign countries the slave South is irrelevant.

Why should everyone else buy American when you're buying Thai?

[phk]

UPDATE: Madison Schools Go To Court To Get Teachers Back

[Filuwaúrdjan]

Overtime is part of it. They all call in sick (personal days) at the same time, so the place is "understaffed," and overtime needs to be paid. They take turns. They must have a spreadsheet to manage it all. Overtime is particularly toxic, because their bloated defined benefit plan compensation gets a steroidal boost from playing the overtime game. It is really quite a dirty little nest that they inhabit.

Well its great that they can do that, Torie.  Do you propose that no one may be allowed to be ill?  Or that there be the same hourly pay for persons working over the 40 hour week?  People died in the 1930s fighting for these (incredibly meager) rights..  I'd hate to see them go just because your class wants more golden toilet bowls.

The people in the 1930s died for union rights in the private sector. Unfortunately they were undercut by Alabama, Arizona, Oklahoma and Texas. Wake me up when there's a UAW chapter striking at the Hyundai plant.

Which in turn is partially a result of the failure (or the circumstances of the failure) of the 1934 mill strike.

[jimrtex]

In its Jan. 31 memo to legislators on the condition of the state’s budget, the Fiscal Bureau determined that the state will end the year with a balance of $121.4 million.

(snip)_

Here is the document. Enjoy reading.

http://legis.wisconsin.gov/lfb/Misc/2011_01_31Vos&Darling.pdf

Wisconsin requires that a general account balance of $65 million.  So the projected net balance was $56 billion.

But you apparently did not read Page 3, which noted the $153 million shortfall in Medicaid and $22 million in corrections budget just to get through June.

You would also have known about those if you had read the fiscal note for the pending legislation.

And you also ignore the $60 million that Wisconsin owes Minnesota, and the $200 million that Wisconsin illegally transferred from the Patients Compensation Fund in 2007-9.  Read Page 2

So, the budget situation was so grim that Walker's first action was to cut taxes.
Makes sense.

What were the bill numbers of the legislation that cut taxes?  They should have a fiscal note.

[jimrtex]

In its Jan. 31 memo to legislators on the condition of the state’s budget, the Fiscal Bureau determined that the state will end the year with a balance of $121.4 million.

(snip)_

Here is the document. Enjoy reading.

http://legis.wisconsin.gov/lfb/Misc/2011_01_31Vos&Darling.pdf

Wisconsin requires that a general account balance of $65 million.  So the projected net balance was $56 billion.

But you apparently did not read Page 3, which noted the $153 million shortfall in Medicaid and $22 million in corrections budget just to get through June.

You would also have known about those if you had read the fiscal note for the pending legislation.

And you also ignore the $60 million that Wisconsin owes Minnesota, and the $200 million that Wisconsin illegally transferred from the Patients Compensation Fund in 2007-9.  Read Page 2

That still doesn't get anywhere near the $3.6 billion that Walker is claiming. It's true that the state probably has a shortfall that large based on projected agency requests for future years, but that report is pretty misleading.

How is the report misleading?  It mainly is concentrated on 2010-1.  It does make revenue projections for 2011-2013.

The pending legislation does include the Medicaid and Corrections funding for the fiscal biennium that ends in June, though I think it is a bit less than the note

[opebo]

The people in the 1930s died for union rights in the private sector. Unfortunately they were undercut by Alabama, Arizona, Oklahoma and Texas. Wake me up when there's a UAW chapter striking at the Hyundai plant.

Actually with free trade with foreign countries the slave South is irrelevant.

Why should everyone else buy American when you're buying Thai?

because I relocated

[Gustaf]

The people in the 1930s died for union rights in the private sector. Unfortunately they were undercut by Alabama, Arizona, Oklahoma and Texas. Wake me up when there's a UAW chapter striking at the Hyundai plant.

Actually with free trade with foreign countries the slave South is irrelevant.

Why should everyone else buy American when you're buying Thai?

because I relocated

Then why shouldn't corporations be allowed to relocate their factories so as to allow them to buy cheap Thai labour as well?

[opebo]

Why should everyone else buy American when you're buying Thai?

because I relocated

Then why shouldn't corporations be allowed to relocate their factories so as to allow them to buy cheap Thai labour as well?

Because they propose to bring items back to the United States, obviously, Gustaf.  If they wish to relocate and bring nothing back, as I do, then good luck to them.  I'm not allowed to bring back prostitutes with me when I return to the Bad Place.

[TheDeadFlagBlues]