SENATE BILL: Mask Mandate Act (Passed)

[Southern Senator North Carolina Yankee]

Mask Mandate Act

To mandate the usage of masks nationwide in response to the COVID 19 pandemic

1. Starting 3 days after the passage of this bill, Atlasian citizens shall wear masks on the following situations:
   a. In any means of public transport
   b. In any shops, commerces or other public enclosed spaces; except those dedicated to the consumption of food and drinks
   c. Inside cars, if the people in the car do not live in the same household
2. People who do not follow this rule shall be fined $200
3. This bill shall not apply to people under the age of 6, nor to anyone with health issues where a doctor has prescribed that the usage of a mask would be negative for the patient's health
4. This bill shall automatically sunset on December 31st, 2021; or when the WHO declares the COVID-19 pandemic officially over
5. States may be exempted from having the mask mandate apply within them if they provide a formal request for an exemption to the President and the President accepts this request within 7 days.

Sponsor: Tack50
Senate Designation: SB25:11

[Southern Senator North Carolina Yankee]

Initial Debate Period - Sponsor Advocacy

[Former President tack50]

Basically, I am introducing this bill on behalf of president Pericles, to create a federal obligation for people to wear masks in certain situations, most notably in public transport and inside stores and other kinds of commerces.

Section 2 specifies the punishment for non-compliance (a 200$ fine, which is not so much that it would be too harsh, but is harsh enough that people will wear masks)

Section 3 gives exceptions for young children and for people with health issues

Section 4 creates an automatic sunset clause at the end of 2021, because this is Atlasia and we will 100% forget to repeal this 1 year from now

Section 5 was added on behalf of the president when discussing this bill before introducing it, and gives the NPC governors the ability to ask for exemptions to this mandate.

[Southern Senator North Carolina Yankee]

Who is administering and policing the fines? and where does that money go?

[Former President tack50]

Who is administering and policing the fines? and where does that money go?

Presumably it'd be the federal government? And the money would go to the federal government's bank account?

Tbh I suppose expecting the FBI to enforce this is unreasonable, I assume most policing in the US is done by local police? Is there some "standard national police force" in the US?

[Dr. MB]

A few things:

1) get rid of the car portion, it's dumb (or make it apply only to Uber or taxi drivers)
2) get rid of the fine
3) make it so the WHO has no responsibility over this and put it on the Atlasian government. The pandemic is probably gonna go on for a long time officially but it will definitely die down before that and masks won't be necessary anymore.

[Former President tack50]

A few things:

1) get rid of the car portion, it's dumb (or make it apply only to Uber or taxi drivers)
2) get rid of the fine
3) make it so the WHO has no responsibility over this and put it on the Atlasian government. The pandemic is probably gonna go on for a long time officially but it will definitely die down before that and masks won't be necessary anymore.

I can see the point of 1 and 3.

However what is the point of this if we don't enforce it through fines?

[Southern Senator North Carolina Yankee]

Who is administering and policing the fines? and where does that money go?

Presumably it'd be the federal government? And the money would go to the federal government's bank account?

Tbh I suppose expecting the FBI to enforce this is unreasonable, I assume most policing in the US is done by local police? Is there some "standard national police force" in the US?

Standard national police force - that is the FBI.  The problem is the FBI usually only gets involved in select issues like say serial killers, terrorism etc, usually when there is a crime that crosses multiple states though that might not be as strict as it was in the past.

Having the FBI enforce a mandate like that would be a tremendous increase in responsibility and presence that they don't have the resources to handle, it would also be very bad long term.

Things of this nature are traditionally handled and enforced locally and that is the approach that is most inline with how the US is structured as well. The downside of that is you end up with a patchwork effort but on the other hand it is very complicated situation to have a Federal mandate enforced by local authorities. We have seen the situation with federal mandates on local enforcement going both ways in terms of constitutionality and cooperation.

[YE]

If the virus is largely eradicated before then (an initial wave of a vaccine is not the end all be all), as long as we’d be willing to modify this accordingly or if the inverse happens, I’m fine.

[Former President tack50]

Who is administering and policing the fines? and where does that money go?

Presumably it'd be the federal government? And the money would go to the federal government's bank account?

Tbh I suppose expecting the FBI to enforce this is unreasonable, I assume most policing in the US is done by local police? Is there some "standard national police force" in the US?

Standard national police force - that is the FBI.  The problem is the FBI usually only gets involved in select issues like say serial killers, terrorism etc, usually when there is a crime that crosses multiple states though that might not be as strict as it was in the past.

Having the FBI enforce a mandate like that would be a tremendous increase in responsibility and presence that they don't have the resources to handle, it would also be very bad long term.

Things of this nature are traditionally handled and enforced locally and that is the approach that is most inline with how the US is structured as well. The downside of that is you end up with a patchwork effort but on the other hand it is very complicated situation to have a Federal mandate enforced by local authorities. We have seen the situation with federal mandates on local enforcement going both ways in terms of constitutionality and cooperation.

Well, then I suppose we should ask local police departments to enforce this then, though as you say it is far from an ideal solution. We could also just introduce thsi bill x3 in the 3 regions though regional measures for Covid seem to me like the kind that will be forgotten about and in 2025 we will suddenly find that the South still is under a stay at home order or something lol.

I will say that here, any police force was (and is) authorized to fine you for breaking the mask wearing rules (or more importantly, the stay at home orders when those were a thing).

So regardless of whether you got caught by your local police, the national police or the gendarmerie; you got fined equally. Obviously since the last 2 don't exist in the US (and by extension Atlasia) outside the FBI (which would not really be in charge of enforcing stuff like this) that means that enforcement will have to fall primarily on local police departments.

If we need to give them some incentive, maybe they can be given a cut of the fines (or even all the fine money). Though that also creates perverse incentives but that happens with all kinds of fines. Or we can give it to municipalities and counties instead of to the police directly.

[Southern Senator North Carolina Yankee]

Who is administering and policing the fines? and where does that money go?

Presumably it'd be the federal government? And the money would go to the federal government's bank account?

Tbh I suppose expecting the FBI to enforce this is unreasonable, I assume most policing in the US is done by local police? Is there some "standard national police force" in the US?

Standard national police force - that is the FBI.  The problem is the FBI usually only gets involved in select issues like say serial killers, terrorism etc, usually when there is a crime that crosses multiple states though that might not be as strict as it was in the past.

Having the FBI enforce a mandate like that would be a tremendous increase in responsibility and presence that they don't have the resources to handle, it would also be very bad long term.

Things of this nature are traditionally handled and enforced locally and that is the approach that is most inline with how the US is structured as well. The downside of that is you end up with a patchwork effort but on the other hand it is very complicated situation to have a Federal mandate enforced by local authorities. We have seen the situation with federal mandates on local enforcement going both ways in terms of constitutionality and cooperation.

Well, then I suppose we should ask local police departments to enforce this then, though as you say it is far from an ideal solution. We could also just introduce thsi bill x3 in the 3 regions though regional measures for Covid seem to me like the kind that will be forgotten about and in 2025 we will suddenly find that the South still is under a stay at home order or something lol.

I will say that here, any police force was (and is) authorized to fine you for breaking the mask wearing rules (or more importantly, the stay at home orders when those were a thing).

So regardless of whether you got caught by your local police, the national police or the gendarmerie; you got fined equally. Obviously since the last 2 don't exist in the US (and by extension Atlasia) outside the FBI (which would not really be in charge of enforcing stuff like this) that means that enforcement will have to fall primarily on local police departments.

If we need to give them some incentive, maybe they can be given a cut of the fines (or even all the fine money). Though that also creates perverse incentives but that happens with all kinds of fines. Or we can give it to municipalities and counties instead of to the police directly.

Local authorities are bound to uphold the laws and constitution in the US. That includes Federal laws, so at least they cannot outright break them. A lot of things that are crimes in the US are crimes at the state level including most crimes of violence for instance. Therefore, assuming the are of concern is an area with recognized Federal power and one could make a case based on interstate commerce concerning the transmission of the virus, though I am not in a position to parce those legalities at this moment, that the Federal gov't has the authority to act but even then you still have the secondary hurdle of how the relationship with the local authorities is handled since there have been times such as immigration where courts have ruled that cooperation is voluntary on the basis of it being a "federal responsibility". So you have to thread the needle of finding sufficient federal responsibility while at the same time not falling in the immigration trap of it being "federal responsibility so you cannot bind the states to act etc".

[Former President tack50]

Re: the comparison with immigration, I suppose you are referring here to stuff like "sanctuary cities" and what not?

I definitely trust all 3 regional governments to not  issue any executive orders that would make it so regional and state police can't enforce this mandate. If anything I'd expect the opposite (and we can always tell MB / R2D2 & n1240 / Truman to pass a executive order to enforce this mandate if needed)

I do worry about hypothetical NPCs rebelling against this mandate, but I hope they don't. But if they do I suppose there is there really nothing we can do about it?

[Southern Senator North Carolina Yankee]

Re: the comparison with immigration, I suppose you are referring here to stuff like "sanctuary cities" and what not?

I definitely trust all 3 regional governments to not  issue any executive orders that would make it so regional and state police can't enforce this mandate. If anything I'd expect the opposite (and we can always tell MB / R2D2 & n1240 / Truman to pass a executive order to enforce this mandate if needed)

I do worry about hypothetical NPCs rebelling against this mandate, but I hope they don't. But if they do I suppose there is there really nothing we can do about it?

Mess around with federal funding, but that also has limits with the immigration issue being the first one that comes to mind in this regards.

[Southern Senator North Carolina Yankee]

So I take it we need amendments here?

I can take a crack at it later tomorrow (Saturday depending on your timezone), but I would prefer to see if Tack has something in mind first in this regards.

[Former President tack50]

So I take it we need amendments here?

I can take a crack at it later tomorrow (Saturday depending on your timezone), but I would prefer to see if Tack has something in mind first in this regards.

I have no idea how to fix the jurisdiction and funding issue, so go ahead, no need to wait for me

[Southern Senator North Carolina Yankee]

Tack what do you think of this wording? Not offering this yet.

Mask Mandate Act

To mandate the usage of masks nationwide in response to the COVID 19 pandemic

1. Starting 30 days after the passage of this bill, all regions receiving federal funding must institute mandatory usage of masks in the following situations:
   a. In any means of public transport
   b. In any shops, commerce or other public enclosed spaces; except those dedicated to the consumption of food and drinks
   c. Inside cars, if the people in the car do not live in the same household
2. People who do not follow this rule shall be fined $200
3. This bill shall not apply to people under the age of 6, nor to anyone with health issues where a doctor has prescribed that the usage of a mask would be negative for the patient's health
4. This bill shall automatically sunset on December 31st, 2021; or when the WHO declares the COVID-19 pandemic officially over
5. States may be exempted from having the mask mandate apply within them if they provide a formal request for an exemption to the President and the President accepts this request within 7 days.

[Former President tack50]

No objection to the amendment, though I am not sure it solves the jurisdiction issue? I am also assuming section 6 got cut off somewhere?

[Southern Senator North Carolina Yankee]

No objection to the amendment, though I am not sure it solves the jurisdiction issue? I am also assuming section 6 got cut off somewhere?

Its actually a remnant I forgot to delete. I was going to alter clause 1 and then have a section 6 about funding, but I decided it would be less clunky to do it in one clause.

As for jurisdictional concerns, beyond funding, I am frankly at a loss here. Even IRL Biden's "mask mandate" proposal is merely in the form of a request by the President to the Governors to institute such a mandate, unless that has evolved in recent days.

[Southern Senator North Carolina Yankee]

Okay if that is the model we are thus proceeding with, then I need to know what federal funding to make it conditional on?

[Former President tack50]

Okay if that is the model we are thus proceeding with, then I need to know what federal funding to make it conditional on?

Do local police departments get funded by the federal government? (whether in part or in full). If so, then it's an easy choice, just withhold funds for police

[Pericles]

Can we please have some more urgency on this? If people need my help then PM me and I'll see what I can do.

[Southern Senator North Carolina Yankee]

Mask Mandate Act

To mandate the usage of masks nationwide in response to the COVID 19 pandemic

1. Starting 30 days after the passage of this bill, all regions receiving federal funding for police departments must institute mandatory usage of masks in the following situations:
   a. In any means of public transport
   b. In any shops, commerce or other public enclosed spaces; except those dedicated to the consumption of food and drinks
   c. Inside cars, if the people in the car do not live in the same household
2. People who do not follow this rule shall be fined $200
3. This bill shall not apply to people under the age of 6, nor to anyone with health issues where a doctor has prescribed that the usage of a mask would be negative for the patient's health
4. This bill shall automatically sunset on December 31st, 2021; or when the WHO declares the COVID-19 pandemic officially over
5. States may be exempted from having the mask mandate apply within them if they provide a formal request for an exemption to the President and the President accepts this request within 7 days.

[Southern Senator North Carolina Yankee]

Offering thus in the interim until we can get some legal clarity and have spoken to the President on this matter.

[Former President tack50]

Friendly

[Southern Senator North Carolina Yankee]

Senators have 24 hours to object.