Italy 2013: Maps thread
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Antonio the Sixth
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« Reply #50 on: March 11, 2013, 10:58:11 PM »

I'll try a map of the whole country if you give me a week or so.

Cheesy Cheesy Cheesy Cheesy Cheesy Cheesy Cheesy Cheesy Cheesy
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Franknburger
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« Reply #51 on: March 12, 2013, 12:34:44 AM »

Fascinating thread. Smiley

Before this crazy election, what were the big historical (like recent historical Tongue ) political divides in Italy based on? Religion, region, class mostly? Anyone care to give some specifics to this American poster and European-politics n00b? Tongue

In essence, the Italian political landscape has been shaped by more than a millennium of Romanic-Germanic conflict, starting with the fall of the (west-) Roman empire at the hands of Odoaker, and the Lombard conquest of Italy in 568. By the end of the first millennium, Northern Italy was reasonably firmly integrated into the Holy Roman Empire of German Nation (Otto the Great's wife Adelheid of Burgundy was Queen of Italy, her grandson Otto III ruled the empire from Northern Italy).

Subsequent power struggle between Emperor and Pope deepened the rift between much of imperial-controlled Northern Italy, and the Papal State in the centre. The struggle between Guelfs (papal) and Ghibellines (emperor) went on for most of the middle age, and is still remembered today, as is signified by the Lega Nord picking its name in allusion to the 12th century Guelfish Lombard League. Dario Fo noted in the early 1980s that Guelf cities tended to vote communist / socialist, while Ghibelline cities voted Christian democratic (it would be interesting to check whether that still holds true today).

The Pope-Emperor conflict reached its height under Emperor Frederick II, who was born and raised in Sicily, and ruled for most of the time from Apulia, thus putting these two regions, as well as much of Southern Italy, firmly into the Ghibelline camp.

So, essentially, what we are seeing today is Guelf areas (former papal territories, Tuscany) and the former city republics of Venice and Genua voting red (Genua actually switched over to MSS), and the Ghibelline territories in the north and south voting blue.  Trento- Alto Adige, with its strong German minority, is a special case - here the major German-speaking party allied with PD.

The only surprises here are Torino and some parts of South Italy, especially the Basilicata, voting red as well - maybe someone with a bit more background on local issues and history can help explaining this.


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Antonio the Sixth
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« Reply #52 on: March 12, 2013, 01:45:06 AM »

Turin was (and to an extent, still is) the industrial heartland of Italy, so it's easy to guess why they would be more prone to voting communist (and their successors, in theory at least).

Basilicata, from what others in this forum have said, is because the DC establishment there was overwhelmingly from the left wing of the party, the one that formed La Margherita which merged with the DS to form the PD.
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minionofmidas
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« Reply #53 on: March 12, 2013, 04:24:23 AM »

Turin was (and to an extent, still is) the industrial heartland of Italy, so it's easy to guess why they would be more prone to voting communist (and their successors, in theory at least).
The Communists did a good job organizing the Southern Migrants in the Turin agglomeration; better than at Milan. The grandparents (and for those above a certain age, parents. And for those above another certain age, they themselves) of the vast majority of the inhabitants of Turin's banlieue are Southern born.

Yes, Basilicata took a massive leftward swing with the end of the First Republic, although it (along with Molise) had always been voting somewhat to the left of the more populated parts of the Mezzogiorno even before that.
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Filuwaúrdjan
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« Reply #54 on: March 14, 2013, 02:11:36 PM »

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Antonio the Sixth
Antonio V
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« Reply #55 on: March 14, 2013, 03:28:34 PM »


So Monti took basically all the old "Bourgeois" demochristian vote in the North away from Casini, but left him a significant share of the Southern clientelist vote. Makes sense.

Interesting that FLI didn't do better in Lazio, the old MSI base. Though he did quite well in Calabria, another major MSI base if I well remember.
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Filuwaúrdjan
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« Reply #56 on: March 16, 2013, 11:06:15 AM »

Probably true to an extent, but some of the biggest falls in the UDC vote were in places where Monti-proper didn't do so well. Possible losses Grillowards?
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SPQR
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« Reply #57 on: March 16, 2013, 11:46:33 AM »

Probably true to an extent, but some of the biggest falls in the UDC vote were in places where Monti-proper didn't do so well. Possible losses Grillowards?

Centrists voting for Grillo?
Can't really see that.
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