Mr Hunter's UK Commentary Thread

[Silent Hunter]

AKA What utter rubbish the Daily Mail is spinning today, among other things

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/pages/live/articles/news/news.html?in_article_id=501128&in_page_id=1770

For those of you who don't want to read the thing, I'll summarise in brief. A new study has found that since Labour came to power in 1997, 1.7 million new jobs have been created. The Daily "Hate" Mail has stated that 4 out of 5 of these new jobs have gone to "migrants". 2.1 million more people are now employed in the UK than in 1997, 1.1 million being foreign citizens.

Now, assuming this is accurate, there's one major problem. The definition of "migrants" is too wide.

Britain has always been a country of immigration. The Romans, the Normans... Let's just narrow our frame down to the period after the Second World War. We have (an incomplete list):
* Those from the Caribbean who came over in the late 1950s. Not all would have been non-UK citizens (Jamaica didn't gain independence until 1962), but some of them would have been.
* Ugandan Asians
* Those from the Indian sub-continent in the 1970s.
* Those from the 2004 EU intake.

Those from the 2004 intake haven't had a chance to become UK citizens- many haven't even got permanent leave to remains.

If I (being alive at that time- I wasn't) had left Ghana in 1959, two years after Independence, I'd be a Ghanaian citizen moving to the UK and ergo a migrant. I acquire a UK passport in the mid 1970s. If I got a new job in 1999, I would be counted as "a migrant" despite having lived in the UK for 40 years.

Sir Andrew Green should look at his facts more carefully. How did he get his knighthood anyway?

[Silent Hunter]

At the end of the day, the job should go to the best person capable of doing it, whatever their nationality, unless there's a compelling reason for it to be otherwise (as in national security).

afleitch, is that that youth unemployment figure those who are not in work, training or education?

[Silent Hunter]

Hang on, don't those youth employment figures cover all youths, British or not?

[Silent Hunter]

Hang on, don't those youth employment figures cover all youths, British or not?

Yes, in the same manner that employment figures as we've noted cover all workers. FTR Youth unemployment fell and started rising almost exponentially in 2004. I don't quite see what your getting at considering youth unemployment was the very last point of the post

2004 was the year of the EU expansion. If a lot of young Central and Eastern Europeans came over at that point and became unemployed then or later, it would naturally raise the figures (both as percentage and raw, since they wouldn't necessarily speak the language). They're merely shifting youth unemployment from the 2004 entrants to the UK.

It's like the American uninsured numbers, interesting but useless when one thinks about it.

[Silent Hunter]

Figures change in everything. Death tallies, employment, how many people watched a TV programme. Better communication is needed, but more often than not it's a Civil Service error.

Prospects for employment? Much better than they were under Mr. Major and Mrs. Thatcher.

One potential problem with that Rowntree report- the 300% figure, which I'd like actual numbers. If the figure for over 25s rose dramatically and the 16-24 figures remained the same, then the difference would rise.

The number of foreign workers in the UK has risen because there are more foreigners, true. Then again, a lot of those are doing jobs that most Brits don't want to do.

[Silent Hunter]

One more point on employment, afleitch. Ageing population must at least partly contribute to the drop in UK employment numbers.

Changing the subject somewhat (although the previous conversation may continue), who here would drink "champagne" out of a can?

[Silent Hunter]

Why is the Civil Service continually losing things?

[Silent Hunter]

I've just finished watching Schindler's List. If you haven't yet seen that film, I strongly suggest you do.

If you're ever in Poland and can so do, I also suggest you visit Auschwitz.

[Silent Hunter]

Major commentary on the US presidential election will wait until the nominees are clear. I don't want to write a full thing on Huckabee/Obama now and have Huckabee/Clinton or something completely different. It's still only Iowa (who decides to start this thing so early now- Congress should step in).

[Silent Hunter]

When has it ever been safe to walk the streets of London alone at night?