Karen Pence returns to teaching at anti-LBGTQ school

[Fuzzy Bear]

Christian schools have every right to hold students and faculty to Biblical standards of conduct.  That's why they're in business.  I'm sure that if a student came to a Christian school and recruited for Stormfront, they'd be expelled, and that's within the perogative of a Christian school.  This school will not allow for homosexual behavior or advocacy of same.  That's their perogative. 

The legality of gay marriage may well be a settled issue for my lifetime, as the legality of abortion appears to be.  The acceptability and moral correctness of those issues is most certainly not settled, however.  At least not on Earth.  These issues ARE most certainly settled in Heaven, however, and certainly not in the manner of Supreme Court rulings. 

I'm not going to say that the Bible condones homosexual activity.  Because it doesn't.  Scripture says what it says, and if I'm dissonance in the Echo Chamber, so be it.   

[Fuzzy Bear]

Karen Pence's decision is fairly typical but another issue with this is the fact that schools exist at all that won't admit LGBTQA+ students. That is the most shameful thing of all.

That's not the issue here, either.  A gay student going to a school like this would be very bad for that student.  It's everything about it that is bad.  

Good point.

But Freedom of Religion! Freedom of Expression! Blah, blah, blah! Because, you know, those rights make it okay to limit everyone else's.

Folks. It's a matter of good and evil. It really is that simple, I'm sorry to say.

People's Freedom of Expression is limited all the time.  And lawfully so.  People don't get to wear their Stormfront T-shirts to work on Casual Day, and rightfully so. 

No one is required to attend a religious public school.  One enrolls their kids in such a school with the understanding that is is what it is and the rules are what they are.  You don't get to go there and openly advocate behavior that is anti-Biblical.  This is true for church employment as well.

Echo Chamber threads like this aren't about honest discussion of issues.  They're about attempting to force people to outwardly conform to a viewpoint that millions do not accept, and cannot accept, for reasons that have to do with Scripture.  It's not enough for someone like me to refrain from discriminating in housing, employment, etc.  It won't be enough until I admit I'm wrong, and they're right, and, even then, a period of prescribed shaming will be in order.

So that's not going to happen, because I'm not going to say God is wrong.  I'm not going to say that the Bible is not the inerrant Word of God.  I'm not going to say the Bible means something very different than what it means, and I'm not going to buy into other points of view that require buying into all sorts of gyrations to come to their conclusion.  

[Fuzzy Bear]

She couldn't get a job at one of DC's many public schools?

Or does Karen Pence just not think black children are as deserving of learning about art?

Perhaps Karen Pence wishes to be part of bringing up children in the fear and admonition of the Lord, and not be part of infusing them with secular doctrines that have, as far as I am concerned, damaged the institution of the nuclear family to tragic levels.

[Fuzzy Bear]

Christian schools have every right to hold students and faculty to Biblical standards of conduct.  That's why they're in business.  I'm sure that if a student came to a Christian school and recruited for Stormfront, they'd be expelled, and that's within the perogative of a Christian school.  This school will not allow for homosexual behavior or advocacy of same.  That's their perogative. 

Why are you so certain about this? Such activities would not contradict a "biblical lifestyle". In fact depending on the interpretation of the Curse of Ham, they would be entirely in line with biblical teaching.

Absolute nonsense.

I'm not going to comment on some extremist academy you might find in some obscure place, but 99% of Christian schools would not put up with this, nor would they consider this in line with Biblical teaching. 

Posts like this are pure propaganda, repeating a falsehood to where it will seem real to some who don't know better.

[Fuzzy Bear]

Christian schools have every right to hold students and faculty to Biblical standards of conduct.  That's why they're in business.  I'm sure that if a student came to a Christian school and recruited for Stormfront, they'd be expelled, and that's within the perogative of a Christian school.  This school will not allow for homosexual behavior or advocacy of same.  That's their perogative. 

Why are you so certain about this? Such activities would not contradict a "biblical lifestyle". In fact depending on the interpretation of the Curse of Ham, they would be entirely in line with biblical teaching.

Absolute nonsense.

I'm not going to comment on some extremist academy you might find in some obscure place, but 99% of Christian schools would not put up with this, nor would they consider this in line with Biblical teaching. 

Posts like this are pure propaganda, repeating a falsehood to where it will seem real to some who don't know better.

That 99% you so blithely claim would have been more like 50/50 less than 60 years ago, and a distinct minority south of the Mason-Dixon line. Please don't rewrite history as if the word of God was not actively and widely used as an excuse to forestall interracial marriage.

The word of God is eternal, fuzzy, but Humanity's misuse and misunderstanding of it is likewise timeless, and constantly needs to be struggled against.

If people did this, they were incorrect, and not on sound Scriptural ground. 

And stating that Scripture does not condone homosexual activity is the truth.  If people have problems dealing with that, so be it.  Most people come to a point in their lives when they have to choose between God and their own likes, ideals, etc. 

Churches are made of imperfect folks.  I'm well aware of Pastors that were hirelings of the mill owners in South Carolina that preached the evil of unions, etc.  Man is corruptible, but the Word of God is Eternal, and it is clear on the subject of homosexuality.  No matter what you say.  And no matter what you may wish that would make your argument easier to make.

[Fuzzy Bear]

Christian schools have every right to hold students and faculty to Biblical standards of conduct.  That's why they're in business.  I'm sure that if a student came to a Christian school and recruited for Stormfront, they'd be expelled, and that's within the perogative of a Christian school.  This school will not allow for homosexual behavior or advocacy of same.  That's their perogative. 

The legality of gay marriage may well be a settled issue for my lifetime, as the legality of abortion appears to be.  The acceptability and moral correctness of those issues is most certainly not settled, however.  At least not on Earth.  These issues ARE most certainly settled in Heaven, however, and certainly not in the manner of Supreme Court rulings. 

I'm not going to say that the Bible condones homosexual activity.  Because it doesn't.  Scripture says what it says, and if I'm dissonance in the Echo Chamber, so be it.

People's Freedom of Expression is limited all the time.  And lawfully so.  People don't get to wear their Stormfront T-shirts to work on Casual Day, and rightfully so.

She couldn't get a job at one of DC's many public schools?

Or does Karen Pence just not think black children are as deserving of learning about art?

Perhaps Karen Pence wishes to be part of bringing up children in the fear and admonition of the Lord, and not be part of infusing them with secular doctrines that have, as far as I am concerned, damaged the institution of the nuclear family to tragic levels.

Ok, these posts are crossing the line for me. I don't care how many paragraphs you write, this is horrendous. Disgusting. Abhorrent. Offensive. Should I find more words to describe how bad these posts are? First of all, you compared my very f**king existence to nazis. TWICE. Seems like it's a comparison you believe in very strongly. Second, you keep frevently claiming that me, we, millions of wonderful people, are ammoral, our very existence is a tragedy, that barring us from a school would somehow make it BETTER. No, I don't care how "respectful" you sound saying that. I don't care if you excuse your hateful and loathing views with a line in the old testament. These posts are some of the worst I've seen on Atlas and are truly loathsome.

But, at least I know that these views are rapidly disappearing from our earth, and that you'll continue to be part of an increasingly small, bitter and irrelevant minority. While we finally gain our rights and our freedom.

But Freedom of Religion! Freedom of Expression! Blah, blah, blah! Because, you know, those rights make it okay to limit everyone else's.

Folks. It's a matter of good and evil. It really is that simple, I'm sorry to say.

Yep, absolutely agreed.

Scripture says what it says, and it means what it means.  The idea that it means something else, other than what I have is, quite honestly, hard to defend.

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We are not judged under the Law, for no man can keep it.  We are judged under Grace, through Faith in Jesus Christ.  The Law, however, exists to tell us just exactly what sin is.

So here's an honest question:  What would you have me do in this situation?  I can please God, or I can please individuals.  Given that I, Karen and Mike Pence, Representative Carpetbagger (and other Atlas Christians), and hundreds of millions of Christians in America, alone, have to wrestle with this issue, what are we to do, given that we believe that Jesus Christ is who He says He is in Scripture.

Scripture instructs believers "Insofar as it is possible within YOU, live in peace with ALL men (emphasis added both times)."  I wish to win souls for the Kingdom, and every lost soul has a shot at being Saved until that last nanosecond of life is over.  I will show kindness to people who life lifestyles of any kind that I believe are un-Biblical.  But I'm not going to tell people God is OK with what they're doing when Scripture tells me that He's not, and I'm not going to help people seal themselves into a posture of what I believe God would view as rebellion against His Authority. 

I guess my bottom line is this:  I'll be kind to everyone.  I'll not practice discrimination against folks in housing, secular employment, etc.  I'll respect persons' individual choices, and I will not torment people with unwanted Evangelizing or Bible Study.  And I will do so recognizing that, for many here, this will never be enough.   What is wanted (indeed, DEMANDED by some) is that I renounce God's Authority and deceive people as to what I believe God Himself, has said on this subject.  This, I cannot do, and will not do. 

To those of you who believe I have "crossed a line", that is probably true.  If I were to (for example) post here that I am all for SSM (for example) and that God signs off on this (the more important declaration), then I have crossed another line; the line of misrepresenting God, Himself, and mis-presenting His Will.  And, in my case, I would be doing so deliberately, because God will hold me accountable for what I already know.  On this subject, I am going to "cross a line" either way.  One line is drawn by God, the other by other people (including people that I, personally, would consider to be FFs).  Which line should I be worried more about crossing?  Which line would you be worried more about crossing if you were in my position between man and God?

[Fuzzy Bear]

Lots of words

First of all, it's dishonest to say that you're just doing what God said. Don't put the responsibility of all your words on Jesus, it's cowardly and doesn't make you a saint. It still makes you a person who supports denying innocent children entry to a school just because of what they are.

NOWHERE in the scripture does it specifically say that gays shouldn't be allowed to Christian school. It does say that gays should be stoned to death, though. Will you act on that? I'm waiting.

If you ask me what I'd have you did as a devout Christian- do what most devout Christians today do. Don't compare homosexuals to nazis. Don't support outright and gross discrimination and abuse of children. Ideally, also don't oppose equal civil rights for us, our judgement will be in heaven.

Of course, if God is truly just, he'll not punish us for what we are. He'll punish those who hate us for that. If he will punish me for that... Well, I won't say what I think about Him. That would be blasphemy.

God gave me free will.  I own what I write here.  Ultimately, I'm responsible to Him.

I will, however, assert that what I say is backed up by Scripture.  I, personally, care less what others do in the privacy of their homes.  I really don't care, personally, about seeing what people do in public, to a certain extent.  I don't want to see a person of the same gender grab their same sex partner's butt in public, in front of kids, but I wouldn't want to see a married man to it to his female spouse in public, either, even if it's consensual.  If you boil my actual stance on this issue down to the nub, it's something like, "Personally, what you do is up to you, but don't ask me to sign off on it and say God is OK with it."  

https://www.nytimes.com/2019/01/16/us/politics/karen-pence-school-lgbt-ban.html

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This is what Scripture says.  It's a Faith-Based School.  It has every right to require its faculty to be in agreement of basic principles.  

Would a Yeshiva require conformity in the same manner?  Would a Palestinian Arab Muslim be welcome in one, either here or in Israel as a faculty member?  Would a Jew who avowed that Israel is a Jewish State and Jerusalem is its Capital openly be welcome in a Muslim Academy as a faculty member?  Would a parent who viewed wearing a Hijab as sexist be allowed to attend a Muslim Academy?  Would a Evangelical Christian student who was accepted as a student be permitted to present the Gospel to other students on campus in either of these settings, even during free time? What would happen if they did?

Would these institutions require their faculty to conform their personal lives to the philosophy of the school, at least to the point where one could say that they were "congruent"?  

At a minimum, Karen Pence does not deserve the condemnation she has received here.  If she does, then what shall we say for Jewish and Muslim Schools, their requirements, and their rules?  

This thread is an unfair attack on Mrs. Pence, and on Christian School Teachers.  My wife teaches Kindergarten at a Christian School.  People can say what they will.  I will defend the Faith and I will defend the Faithful.

[Fuzzy Bear]

I should also point out that school-age children in the age ranges that Mrs. Pence school accomodates ought not be having sex in the first place.

[Fuzzy Bear]

I'm not going to say that the Bible condones homosexual activity. Because it doesn't.  Scripture says what it says, and if I'm dissonance in the Echo Chamber, so be it.   

In 20-30 years, when your denomination sanctions gay marriage and even your particular church building performs them, you'll find some contrivance for how you were never actually wrong and the church isn't now either. Maybe a long string of paragraphs about how Muslims were always worse to the gays or something.

I know very little about Pentecostals, so I have no idea if there is a powerful pro-LGBT movement within that denomination.  However, I have little doubt that in 20-30 years Bible believing Christians will be very unpopular.  Anyone who still identifies as such won't care about social pressure at that point I think.

What is it with homophobes and thinking that  the only reason we want them to change is "social pressure"? It's because accepting LGBT people is the morally right thing to do, not because it's hip or trendy.

"Accepting LGBT people" can mean a lot of things.  I accept them on an equal basis for housing, employment, etc.  I personally don't care what one's private life is.  There are people I know who have sex outside of marriage and I know people that commit adultery.  I accept them all.  I accept SSM as a fait acompli, and I"m not on a crusade to repeal it.  But I'm not going to say God thinks it's OK, because it's not.  As far as being Morally Correct, I'll rely on Scripture, and not Atlas Leftists (or Atlas Anybodies, for that matter).

[Fuzzy Bear]

She’s trash. I am so grateful I left behind religion and all of its toxicity. I refuse to debate FACTS with these religious zealot lunatics.

Posts like this lead me to believe that Stacey Abrams' loss was a good thing.  She's a candidate that I had hoped would win, but imagining her Administration being populated by folks with your worldview is hardly a comforting thought.

[Fuzzy Bear]

She’s trash. I am so grateful I left behind religion and all of its toxicity. I refuse to debate FACTS with these religious zealot lunatics.

Posts like this lead me to believe that Stacey Abrams' loss was a good thing.  She's a candidate that I had hoped would win, but imagining her Administration being populated by folks with your worldview is hardly a comforting thought.

It’s very weird that you’re glad the Governor who would have expanded access to healthcare to 500,000 Georgians lost because of a random post on the Internet. I’m intrigued that I have so much power over you.

I cannot believe that you consider that I, or persons like me, have legitimate issues that government ought to address.  I believe that because I present as a white, Christian, non-liberal (not always conservative, however), you would dismiss my petitions/grievances, regardless of the merits.  If you worked for Abrams, you'd filter the information to her.  If Abrams hired you, she'd know what you were about.

I judge candidates in part by their campaign help.  Those people are likely the people who will populate their administration.

[Fuzzy Bear]

She’s trash. I am so grateful I left behind religion and all of its toxicity. I refuse to debate FACTS with these religious zealot lunatics.

Posts like this lead me to believe that Stacey Abrams' loss was a good thing.  She's a candidate that I had hoped would win, but imagining her Administration being populated by folks with your worldview is hardly a comforting thought.

It’s very weird that you’re glad the Governor who would have expanded access to healthcare to 500,000 Georgians lost because of a random post on the Internet. I’m intrigued that I have so much power over you.

I cannot believe that you consider that I, or persons like me, have legitimate issues that government ought to address.  I believe that because I present as a white, Christian, non-liberal (not always conservative, however), you would dismiss my petitions/grievances, regardless of the merits.  If you worked for Abrams, you'd filter the information to her.  If Abrams hired you, she'd know what you were about.

I judge candidates in part by their campaign help.  Those people are likely the people who will populate their administration.

Come on fuzzy. Surely you would agree that it is unfair to judge a grubenatutorial candidate whose Statewide campaign had literally tens of thousands of campaign workers like RFK fan, that your disagreement with one of them it's a worthy basis to judge? I'm not taking sides in this dispute, but surely would agree this isn't like RFK was going to be in Abrams cabinet, or even I assume getting some third-tier internship if she won.

You would judge Trump by that standard. 

You just judged a whole group of school students by the hats that some of them wore, and supported lies and misrepresentations about their conduct.  Stacy Abrams can bear the baggage of RFKfan68.

[Fuzzy Bear]

She’s trash. I am so grateful I left behind religion and all of its toxicity. I refuse to debate FACTS with these religious zealot lunatics.

Posts like this lead me to believe that Stacey Abrams' loss was a good thing.  She's a candidate that I had hoped would win, but imagining her Administration being populated by folks with your worldview is hardly a comforting thought.

It’s very weird that you’re glad the Governor who would have expanded access to healthcare to 500,000 Georgians lost because of a random post on the Internet. I’m intrigued that I have so much power over you.

I cannot believe that you consider that I, or persons like me, have legitimate issues that government ought to address.  I believe that because I present as a white, Christian, non-liberal (not always conservative, however), you would dismiss my petitions/grievances, regardless of the merits.  If you worked for Abrams, you'd filter the information to her.  If Abrams hired you, she'd know what you were about.

I judge candidates in part by their campaign help.  Those people are likely the people who will populate their administration.

Come on fuzzy. Surely you would agree that it is unfair to judge a grubenatutorial candidate whose Statewide campaign had literally tens of thousands of campaign workers like RFK fan, that your disagreement with one of them it's a worthy basis to judge? I'm not taking sides in this dispute, but surely would agree this isn't like RFK was going to be in Abrams cabinet, or even I assume getting some third-tier internship if she won.

You would judge Trump by that standard. 

You just judged a whole group of school students by the hats that some of them wore, and supported lies and misrepresentations about their conduct.  Stacy Abrams can bear the baggage of RFKfan68.

You are factually wrong on all three of your attempted points. First, I judge Trump by Trump. The fact that they were hurt people on this for who I consider absolute dipsh**tz would not keep me from supporting say Sanders or certain other Democrats just because they do as well.

Second, I'm really disappointed, and frankly a little offended that what you stated about my judging the Covington Clan kids and for what reasons. It's like you didn't read a single damn post I'm a on the subject even though I made the same points over and over and over and over and over again. When people say conservatives don't listen, responses like this tend to prove them right. I similarly judge them by their conduct, or rather misconduct, which I saw with my own two eyes and heard with my own two ears, and nothing else. You are creating strawman just like when you claimed that there were people reluctant to criticize the Black Hebrew Israelites, when in fact those individuals simply do not just exist, either on the form, or is best I can tell elsewhere in the world.

Third, for the reasons stated above, judging a candidate for governor of the 12th largest state in the country are the statements of one of literally tens of thousands of campaign workers is ridiculous. Well that might make you justifiably think less of Abraham's on the whole the company you keep, making that a veto consideration for supporting her is, well, frankly the side of being triggered a little like RFK fan needled you about. You know that's silly.

This entire paragraph defies reason. You jumped down upon those schoolboys as if they were equivalent to Hitler or the KKK, and pushed that continuously across dozens of posts, through some twenty pages of content. For you to claim now that you were treating the situation based only upon "what you saw", and not upon your own biases, is absurd. Hence, when someone says that you would judge Trump based upon similarly hypocritical standards, they are correct. Moreover, your claim that "conservatives don't listen" is also a falsehood. There are people on both ends of the ideological spectrum who are capable of engaging in orderly debate, and who can change their minds if they feel that they were wrong previously.

Um, no? Are you aware that literally everything you just typed is factually incorrect?

And for the record, my biggest objection has never been the racist students. It's with the grown adults adamantly defending Behavior they themselves at least should be old enough to recognize as unacceptable in society today, and rightly so.

Deny all that you want, but your words speak for themselves. And now you're deflecting by claiming the "adults" were at fault, when it was plain that you were bashing the students directly for their actions.

Pretty evidence lacking post you just put there. So yes, my words do speak for themselves. Your complete inability to comprehend them outside of your own chronic narrative is you being you.

And let's make it clear. Of course I've always, and probably continue to condemned those racist misogynistic privileged little s**** for their protest misbehavior. However, I will be equally say that I am more bothered by adults acrostic right-wing Spectrum rally round idiot Boys in pure racial solidarity, and in doing so have a great family minimized where is an outright denied what it means to be racist.

So now you're blaming both the kids and the adults? That is something. And I perfectly understand what you have argued, and what you stand for. And your viewpoints are ones that I strongly disagree with. Moreover, why do you indulge so freely in the use of profanity? Is there no other way for you to articulate your thoughts, except to use foul language every other sentence? I would hope so.

His voice-to-text feature on his device is faulty.  I suggest he contact the manufacturer's rep.

[Fuzzy Bear]

Sodomy is forbidden in the Bible because it disturbs the digestive and excretioniary system, which is the source of one's feeling of being rooted in reality. When this system (referred to as the root chakra in Hinduism) is disturbed (whether because of indigestion or other means), one is much more open to manipulation by malicious spiritual and worldly forces. Thus homosexual and heterosexual sodomy are normalized by Hollywood and pornography, both of which exist primarily to manipulate the psyche of the masses.

All of this must be understood by both sides of the heteronormativity debate.

Are you alright?

You don't get it, do you?

I will say that this is one of the most awesomely cryptic efforts in the History of Atlas.

A-plus for effort.