Israel to Refugees: Go Back to Africa or Go to Prison

[MalaspinaGold]

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https://www.washingtonpost.com/world/middle_east/toughening-its-stance-toward-migrants-israel-pushes-africans-to-leave/2015/05/14/e1637bce-f350-11e4-bca5-21b51bbdf93e_story.html

Israel is the country most active in the fight against the flood of 3rd world migrants who would like to flood every 1st world country, we can learn a lot from what they do, and how it works out.

Amazing that American "conservatives" fall all over themselves to "support Israel" yet believe having similar policies to this in the U.S. is unthinkable.

Ok. Firstly, many American conservatives actually do support such policies. Secondly, there are quite some differences:

- Israel has a "somewhat" less extensive border with Egypt than America has with Mexico.
- Israel drafts people, the U.S. doesn't, so it would be extremely expensive to deploy enough border security personnel along this (already much more extensive) American-Mexican border.
- In the U.S., there are millions of illegals. Even if one would want to deport them all, it would be a hell of an effort. In Israel, the situation is clearer. The number of illegals is limited. Most of them reside in southern Tel Aviv (around the New Central Bus Station) or in "development towns".
- In the U.S., many agricultural companies depend on the labor of illegal workers. In Israel, illegals often either don't work or work like "nomads", meaning that they have different jobs every time.

In short, the situations are not really comparable. What is comparable, however, is that neither the U.S. nor Israel have a moral obligation to pamper illegal immigrants, or even to allow them to stay. Not sure, though, if your thread is actually serious about the differences between these countries or just another thread for Israel-bashing. In the first case, I'm totally down to engage in a discussion. In the second case... nope.

I really have to object to those guys calling themselves Jewish, though.

I really have to object to you calling yourself Jewish. I wouldn't count you in a minyan, but then again, you'd never go to (legitimate) shul anyway, so it doesn't really matter.

To be fair, being Jewish is not really about being religious (which I'm sure everyone bar Haredim can agree on given... history.)

OTOH, the chances of ag's grandchildren being Jewish is about as likely as you voting for Meretz/Hadash/non-terribles so it's not like he matters that much anyway in the long-term.

[MalaspinaGold]

a) You know nothing about human nature
b) You do not understand rootless cosmopolitanism. People only "choose" to be rootless cosompolitans when they have no other choice. Nonharedi Jews today have two options: assimilation and "nationation". Hence there will be no "rootless cosmopolitanism" for the Jews anytime soon.

I stand by my previous statement of course. Wishing your children goodnight in Yiddish may be sweet, but sustain a people it does not do.

[MalaspinaGold]

a) You know nothing about human nature
b) You do not understand rootless cosmopolitanism. People only "choose" to be rootless cosompolitans when they have no other choice. Nonharedi Jews today have two options: assimilation and "nationation". Hence there will be no "rootless cosmopolitanism" for the Jews anytime soon.

I stand by my previous statement of course. Wishing your children goodnight in Yiddish may be sweet, but sustain a people it does not do.

I, obviously, have a choice. I chose to live in Mexico: could have chosen, say, Australia, or Turkey. And I choose not to care about whatever the abstraction you call the people. If my daughter marries a Nigerian and moves to China, I will be perfectly happy. If she starts talking about "preserving the people", I will be wondering where I failed.

When I was a kid, I had my own nationalist stage. I would pester my grandpa with this Jewish people stuff. And he, the last man in the family still to be able to converse Yiddish, would always respond: "I am an internationalist". He was a much wiser man than I will ever be.

For me Jewishness is in the rootlessness. I identify with others, whose families pass through countries and nations without taking a root.

Well, there are people who think like you, and technically no one can stop you from thinking like that. However, the beautiful thing is no one has to, given that "rootlessness" is unsustainable.

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Uhm...... Firstly, I am not "white". Secondly and most importantly, this statement is pretty disturbing and racist.
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This is news. Are you Mizrahi? Or do you align yourself with people like Yehuda HaKohen? If the latter, my respect for you has increased measurably.

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I didn't think the day would come that I would agree with you, but this is true. However, I don't think ag cares about that.
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For better or for worse (most likely the latter) I'm sure there's many things we agree on.

[MalaspinaGold]

You are literally crazy, your worldview is literally crazy, and I'm not going to take the effort to reply to your hogwash once again. I'm going to put you on ignore because your baseless accusations go too far, and I'm sure you will not regret that I'll be doing so. Goodbye.

Stop feeding the troll (even if it's a silly goyishe troll).

[MalaspinaGold]

You are literally crazy, your worldview is literally crazy, and I'm not going to take the effort to reply to your hogwash once again. I'm going to put you on ignore because your baseless accusations go too far, and I'm sure you will not regret that I'll be doing so. Goodbye.

Stop feeding the troll (even if it's a silly goyishe troll).

Not merely a troll, but a goyishe troll. Nice one

I mean truth be told I think you're both silly goyishe trolls, but the difference is you're a silly goyishe troll that solves himself.

[MalaspinaGold]

Meshugga Goyishe Troll is the way I learned it. Or if we want actual Yiddish, משוגע גויישע טראָול. On the other hand, meshugga is not exactly what I was going for.

[MalaspinaGold]

You deserve a medal for your posts here ag, you've summed up exactly how I feel about Israel and my personal, complicated relationship with my own Jewry.

Just out of curiosity what is your relationship with your Judaism (not Jewry, that's a collective noun), and what makes it complicated?

[MalaspinaGold]

You deserve a medal for your posts here ag, you've summed up exactly how I feel about Israel and my personal, complicated relationship with my own Jewry.

Just out of curiosity what is your relationship with your Judaism (not Jewry, that's a collective noun), and what makes it complicated?

Well, all of the controversy seems to come from that nasty little country that I have no connection to yet am somehow expected to have unquestionable loyalty to by many.

You're strawmanning, but more importantly you basically admitted you don't have a relationship with Judaism.

[MalaspinaGold]

You deserve a medal for your posts here ag, you've summed up exactly how I feel about Israel and my personal, complicated relationship with my own Jewry.

Just out of curiosity what is your relationship with your Judaism (not Jewry, that's a collective noun), and what makes it complicated?

Well, all of the controversy seems to come from that nasty little country that I have no connection to yet am somehow expected to have unquestionable loyalty to by many.

You're strawmanning, but more importantly you basically admitted you don't have a relationship with Judaism.

I don't have a relationship with Israel. Is your definition of Judaism determined solely on how one views Israel?

In fact, no. I asked you specifically what is your relationship with Judaism. You mumbled something about standing up to Israel. That may be your legitimate view, but that doesn't indicate a relationship to Judaism. Lots of people don't like Israel; doesn't mean they're all Jews.

Also, DavidB, please clarify what you meant when you said you're not white. I'm genuinely interested.

[MalaspinaGold]

LOL calling Israel monolithic.