CO2 cap-and-trade bill (Awaiting Presdential Signature/Veto)

[Franzl]

I support repeal of the Carbon Tax if this is passed. Only seems fair.

Any other concerns with this? I'm not exactly sure how the regions would distribute the carbon credits, so I wonder if anybody has more specific language that we could use?

Otherwise, I would urge the other senators to support this legislation, as it strikes me as a simpler, more effective and more just system of reducing CO2.

[Franzl]

Is there a reason why you prefer the cap and trade system to a carbon tax? The carbon tax seems like a simpler system and to me and it results in tax revenue which can then be put towards investment in clean energy research. Also it seems that a cap and trade system would put our industries at a disadvantage versus those in countries without carbon caps.

I like the cap and trade system especially because it sets a clear limit as to the total amount of carbon dioxide that may be put out into the atmosphere, which will be continually reduced each year. I also think that many companies will have greater incentives to reduce CO2 emmissions because this system is based on the rules of the market. At a certain point, I believe that the price of these carbon credits will possibly exceed the carbon tax rates.

You're right, the state will miss out on the money it would have made through the carbon tax....but it doesn't seem fair to me that the state make lots of money off of CO2 (not to mention that we don't even know if the state will invest that money into research.

Overall, it just seems more just to me...and provides a better guarantee that carbon emmissions will steadily go down.

[Franzl]

What you said about putting Atlasian companies at a disadvantage is true, BTW. Do you have a proposal what could be done to make the playing field more fair under that kind of a system, or do you believe that the carbon tax system is the only way to go?

I suppose we could set an environmental tax on imports from countries that have no such system...perhaps directly tied to the average price of carbon credits in Atlasia....thereby keeping it market based?

[Franzl]

Not really sure if I support this bill anyway, but question regarding section two: would it not be more fair to proportion the credits among the regions based directly upon their total carbon emissions rather than employed population? Some region might, say, have a higher concentration of high polluting industries and would be forced to reduce at greater rates than other regions.

That's certainly true...I'd be willing to change that accordingly.

[Franzl]

Friendly amendment:

Section 6. Upon passage of this act, FL 20-1 ("The Carbon Tax Act") is repealed.

I accept this amendment as friendly.

[Franzl]

Don't we still have the Carbon Import Tax? So that should take care of foreign competition.

No, that'd still be a problem because the Carbon Import Taxes are directly tied to the rates in Atlasia under the current Carbon tax, and this would abolish the normal Carbon tax.

I suppose we could keep the import rates at those rates artifically...but I dunno, the problem then being that that unnecessarily puts foreign competition at a disadvantage.


Maybe we should just leave the whole thing alone and scrap this bill.

[Franzl]

I like that idea, although we might need to issue more credits originally to make sure that Atlasian companies aren't unreasonably forced down to impossible carbon levels immediately.

[Franzl]

I'm going to amend the bill later today and see what you think.

If we intend on doing this....I would like to get it done relatively quickly.

[Franzl]

I like the idea of putting them on the commodities market, that's something I think I will put in my new version.

[Franzl]

CO2 cap-and-trade bill:

Section 1: In an effort to combat the catastrophic effects of climate change, Atlasia will attempt to reduce overall emmissions of carbon dioxide by regulating the total amount that may be produced through a "cap-and-trade" system.

Section 2: The Atlasian government will provide regions with "climate credits" proportional to their share of employed Atlasians, which will be distributed as regions see fit within their boundaries. The Atlasian government will auction "carbon credits" on the commodities market competitively.

Section 3: These credits may be bought, sold and otherwise transferred among the companies that receive them as they see fit at market based prices.

Section 4: The total level of CO2 credits issued to the regions by the Atlasian government will equal to 98.5% of the total amount of CO2 produced credits issued in the previous year, with the goal of meaningful, long term reduction. The total amount of credits issued in the first year after adoption of this legislation will equal 97% of all carbon taxed by Atlasia in 2008, whether domestically or under carbon import taxation.

Section 5: The Carbon Tax and Carbon Import Tax are repealed.

Section 6: Foreign companies will be allowed to purchase carbon credits on the Atlasian market in the same way a domestic company would.

Section 7: This carbon regulating scheme will last for a maximum minimum of 10 years, after which it will be evaluated again and renewed according to new demands and goals.

[Franzl]

Any comments?

[Franzl]

As nobody seems to want to comment, and it has been 24 hours since I put up my proposal, I wish to call a final vote on this legislation.

[Franzl]

Aye

[Franzl]

We can't even get enough votes to pass in 24 hours?

[Franzl]

This bill has passed. I'd appreciate if the PPT would declare that.

[Franzl]

This seems much less comprehensive than the current CO2 legislation we have. What is wrong with keeping that?

I feel that the a market based system that clearly defines how much carbon is to be produced and allows companies to compete for those rights ultimately is a more just and effective way of dealing with the problem.

[Franzl]

This seems much less comprehensive than the current CO2 legislation we have. What is wrong with keeping that?

I feel that the a market based system that clearly defines how much carbon is to be produced and allows companies to compete for those rights ultimately is a more just and effective way of dealing with the problem.

Fair enough. I do think it could use a few adjustments in the next Senate, including defining penalties for emitting beyond the credits you have purchased, how the foreign purchase of credits would work, etc. Perhaps it would be best for a veto and a recalibration in the next Senate? Otherwise we risk getting stuck with less clear, less comprehensive legislation.

Well, that's certainly something I agree with. We don't have anything there for emitting beyond the issued credits. That could be a problem.

Not sure about the foreign purchasing aspect....why would that be a problem? Don't think they would purchase credits any differently than companies based in Atlasia.


I wouldn't mind a veto for the reason you outlined here, though. I do wish, however, that you had spoken about this matter before the legislation was called to a vote!

The President should decide this matter....I'll just say: If vetoed, I will not seek to override.

[Franzl]

The 19th amendment gives President Bgwah the power to amend the bill to include something about a penalty for emitting beyond issued credits, if he wishes to.

That'd be an even better idea.

[Franzl]

As promised, I will not attempt an override, and I look forward to discussing the issue in the next Senate.