Freezing Alaskans would sooner die than accept free oil from Hugo Chavez
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  Freezing Alaskans would sooner die than accept free oil from Hugo Chavez
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Author Topic: Freezing Alaskans would sooner die than accept free oil from Hugo Chavez  (Read 1962 times)
Joe Republic
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« on: October 10, 2006, 04:01:14 PM »

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Shivering Alaskans to Hugo Chavez: Keep your oil

POSTED: 0109 GMT (0909 HKT), October 9, 2006


In Alaska's native villages, the punishing winter cold is already penetrating the walls of the lightly insulated plywood homes, many of the villagers are desperately poor, and heating-oil prices are among the highest in the nation.

And yet a few of the small communities want to refuse free heating oil from Venezuela, on the patriotic principle that no foreigner has the right to call their president "the devil."

The heating oil is being offered by the petroleum company controlled by Venezuelan President Hugo Chavez, President Bush's nemesis. While scores of Alaska's Eskimo and Indian villages say they have no choice but to accept, others would rather suffer.

"As a citizen of this country, you can have your own opinion of our president and our country. But I don't want a foreigner coming in here and bashing us," said Justine Gunderson, administrator for the tribal council in the Aleut village of Nelson Lagoon. "Even though we're in economically dire straits, it was the right choice to make."

Nelson Lagoon residents pay more than $5 a gallon for oil -- or at least $300 a month per household -- to heat their homes along the wind-swept coast of the Bering Sea, where temperatures can dip to minus-15. About one-quarter of the 70 villagers are looking for work, in part because Alaska's salmon fishing industry has been hit hard by competition from fish farms.

The donation to Alaska's native villages has focused attention on the rampant poverty and high fuel prices in a state that is otherwise awash in oil -- and oil profits. In 2005, 86 percent of the Alaska's general fund, or $2.8 billion, came from oil from the North Slope.

The Aleutian Pribilof Islands Association, a native nonprofit organization that would have handled the heating oil donation on behalf of 291 households in Nelson Lagoon, Atka, St. Paul and St. George, rejected the offer because of the insults Chavez has hurled at Bush.

Chavez called Bush "the devil" in a speech to the United Nations last month. He has also called the president a terrorist and denounced the war in Iraq.(Watch former President Bush call Chavez "an ass" -- 2:10)

Dimitri Philemonof, president and chief executive of the association, said accepting the aid would be "compromising ourselves." "I think we have some duty to our country, and I think it's loyalty," he said.

Over the past two years, Citgo, the Venezuelan government's Texas-based oil subsidiary, has given millions of gallons of discounted heating oil to the poor in several states and cities -- including New York, Connecticut, Vermont, Rhode Island, Massachusetts and Maine -- in what is widely seen as an effort by Chavez to embarrass and irritate the U.S. government and make himself look good.

Maine Gov. John Baldacci, who approved an agreement last winter to buy discounted oil, said he had no plans this year to seek a similar arrangement. In Boston, Massachusetts, a City Council member wants a landmark Citgo sign near Fenway Park taken down and replaced with an American flag. In Florida, a lawmaker asked the state to cancel Citgo's exclusive contract to sell fuel at turnpike service stations.

About 150 native villages in Alaska have accepted money for heating oil from Citgo. The oil company does not operate in Alaska, so instead of sending oil, it is donating about $5.3 million to native nonprofit organizations to buy 100 gallons this winter for each of more than 12,000 households.

"When you have a dire need and it is a matter of survival for your people, it doesn't matter where, what country, the gift or donation comes from," said Virginia Commack, an elder in the arctic village of Ambler, an impoverished Eskimo community of 280 where residents are paying $7.25 a gallon for fuel.

For years, Alaska natives have accused the state and federal governments of sending too little money to their tiny, far-flung communities, where fuel and grocery prices are bloated by the high costs of delivery by plane and barge.

An editorial last month in the Anchorage Daily News bashed the Legislature's rejection in March of an $8.8 million state supplement to a federal program that helps poor Alaskans with home heating costs.

"It's embarrassing that residents in a state with so much oil wealth should be looking to a foreign nation for help," the newspaper said. "It's hard to blame villagers for accepting the gift."

A spokesman for Gov. Frank Murkowski, John Manly, said the governor believes Chavez's donation is a ploy to undermine Americans' faith in their government. But he said it is up to each village to make its own decision.

"It seems like a very strange irony that we produce the oil and yet every year there seems to be a chronic problem in getting the fuel to people that need it," Manly said.

Joan Eddy, principal and teacher at Nelson Lagoon's school, said most buildings in town were erected 30 to 40 years ago, which makes them pretty old, considering how they get battered by the constant 20-25 mph wind coming off the ocean. Their heating systems are aging, too.

She noted the fuel barge is late arriving this year, and said residents are turning on their furnaces for only a few hours in the morning and at night.

"We're conserving as much as we can because we are concerned. It looks like it's going to be a snowy winter and cold," she said.




As much as I admire them for standing up for what they believe in - and I do think it's a noble fight - I really think there are better causes to lay your life on the line for.

Before anybody responds, bear in mind that (according to the article) these people will have to pay $300 a month that they just don't have to stop the -15 temperature from getting in.
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NewFederalist
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« Reply #1 on: October 10, 2006, 04:08:00 PM »

Noble perhaps but stupid. If that despot really wants to give away free oil I say take it. Free is good! It obviously doesn't make money for him to fund any terrorist group with... it's a win-win to take it.
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MasterJedi
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« Reply #2 on: October 10, 2006, 05:26:31 PM »

I'd take the oil and say  you Chavez, you're helping us while continuing to make your country into hell.
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opebo
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« Reply #3 on: October 10, 2006, 10:05:33 PM »

Ok, these people are stupid, Chavez is not a 'despot', and Venezuala is not 'hell'.
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I spent the winter writing songs about getting better
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« Reply #4 on: October 10, 2006, 11:55:20 PM »

Noble perhaps but stupid. If that despot really wants to give away free oil I say take it. Free is good! It obviously doesn't make money for him to fund any terrorist group with... it's a win-win to take it.

yeah, we all know there's a serious problem with Venezuela money going to fund al-Qaeda.

I actually always make sure to buy gas from Citgo when possible because that way my money doesn't go to the Saudis.
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MaC
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« Reply #5 on: October 11, 2006, 02:23:18 AM »

Citgo leaders=HP
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Downwinder
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« Reply #6 on: October 11, 2006, 02:35:53 AM »
« Edited: October 11, 2006, 10:03:37 PM by Downwinder »

yeah, we all know there's a serious problem with Venezuela money going to fund al-Qaeda.

I actually always make sure to buy gas from Citgo when possible because that way my money doesn't go to the Saudis.

Don't say that too loud, Red.  Venezuela may move ahead of Iran in the invasion schedule if the wrong people get that idea.

Oh, and by the way, 7-Eleven Corp. dropped Citgo as their supplier in September, shortly after Chavez' remarks.  I was also buying gas there, as I would prefer the money made go to the poor in Venezuela, instead of the corrupt regime in Saudi Arabia.
http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/15030988/

Citgo and Hugo Chavez=FF.  Are we really so afraid of socialism still, that we have to put Venezuela on a 'watch list'.  Don't we have bigger problems in our foreign policy right now than worrying about Cuba and Venezuela??  Let's stop fighting the war that ended more than a decade ago.
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Nym90
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« Reply #7 on: October 11, 2006, 02:40:07 AM »

It's their choice to make, of course. But I really don't see the logic.

If you hate Chavez, why not take the free oil rather than allowing him to sell it to someone else? Seems it weakens him more to take it than to not.
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Speed of Sound
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« Reply #8 on: October 11, 2006, 06:18:38 AM »

Hey, whatever heats thier houses, or doesnt in this case, I guess.

I'd buy oil from them just because Chavez called Bush the devil.

I must concur with "Noble (if youre into the crazy USA patriotic thing) but stupid"
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NewFederalist
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« Reply #9 on: October 11, 2006, 07:34:36 AM »

It's their choice to make, of course. But I really don't see the logic.

If you hate Chavez, why not take the free oil rather than allowing him to sell it to someone else? Seems it weakens him more to take it than to not.

I thought that was my point, too!
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adam
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« Reply #10 on: October 11, 2006, 08:30:03 AM »

The unspoken American right, is the right to be stupid. However, you will get those who abuse this right day in and day out. I can understand a love of your country, but freezing to death because you are to much of a moron to accept free oil is anything but noble. A hatred of communism should never take precedent over survival.
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nini2287
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« Reply #11 on: October 11, 2006, 09:39:54 AM »

I may consider donating to these people.  They are massive freedom fighters.
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emailking
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« Reply #12 on: October 11, 2006, 10:43:34 AM »

It's only a couple of people they found that has this opinion. And one of them still lives in an igloo and doesn't need heating oil.
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bullmoose88
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« Reply #13 on: October 11, 2006, 11:05:59 AM »

It's their choice to make, of course. But I really don't see the logic.

If you hate Chavez, why not take the free oil rather than allowing him to sell it to someone else? Seems it weakens him more to take it than to not.

Bada bing
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MODU
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« Reply #14 on: October 14, 2006, 12:43:37 AM »



I for one would love to take free oil from Chavez.  That means I'm not paying him for it.  After a while, he will either no longer have enough oil to give away, or he will be broke.
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dazzleman
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« Reply #15 on: October 14, 2006, 07:20:26 AM »

It's their choice to make, of course. But I really don't see the logic.

If you hate Chavez, why not take the free oil rather than allowing him to sell it to someone else? Seems it weakens him more to take it than to not.

Bada bing

I don't agree.  Chavez has plenty of money, and heaven knows he's not spending it to better the lives of his own people.

He is using his money to purchase political propaganda, and taking free oil from him furthers his goals.  He doesn't need the money that selling the oil would have brought him; after all, he's giving away only a very small percentage of it.  It's painless to give away small quantities of things you have in abundance, and it helps him tremendously when he gains propaganda points and credibility in exchange for such a small sacrifice.
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Nym90
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« Reply #16 on: October 15, 2006, 04:29:43 PM »

It's their choice to make, of course. But I really don't see the logic.

If you hate Chavez, why not take the free oil rather than allowing him to sell it to someone else? Seems it weakens him more to take it than to not.

Bada bing

I don't agree.  Chavez has plenty of money, and heaven knows he's not spending it to better the lives of his own people.

He is using his money to purchase political propaganda, and taking free oil from him furthers his goals.  He doesn't need the money that selling the oil would have brought him; after all, he's giving away only a very small percentage of it.  It's painless to give away small quantities of things you have in abundance, and it helps him tremendously when he gains propaganda points and credibility in exchange for such a small sacrifice.

Excelent points.

Of course, the same could be said of any rich philantrophist, or for corporations like Walmart when they do similar things.

Bottom line is that if you don't trust someone, they aren't really going to be able to change your view of them no matter how good their actions are, because you can always use the whole "it's just a ploy to get more support so that they can further their evil schemes" line of logic to rebut it.
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