Israel to Refugees: Go Back to Africa or Go to Prison

[DavidB.]

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https://www.washingtonpost.com/world/middle_east/toughening-its-stance-toward-migrants-israel-pushes-africans-to-leave/2015/05/14/e1637bce-f350-11e4-bca5-21b51bbdf93e_story.html

Israel is the country most active in the fight against the flood of 3rd world migrants who would like to flood every 1st world country, we can learn a lot from what they do, and how it works out.

Amazing that American "conservatives" fall all over themselves to "support Israel" yet believe having similar policies to this in the U.S. is unthinkable.

Ok. Firstly, many American conservatives actually do support such policies. Secondly, there are quite some differences:

- Israel has a "somewhat" less extensive border with Egypt than America has with Mexico.
- Israel drafts people, the U.S. doesn't, so it would be extremely expensive to deploy enough border security personnel along this (already much more extensive) American-Mexican border.
- In the U.S., there are millions of illegals. Even if one would want to deport them all, it would be a hell of an effort. In Israel, the situation is clearer. The number of illegals is limited. Most of them reside in southern Tel Aviv (around the New Central Bus Station) or in "development towns".
- In the U.S., many agricultural companies depend on the labor of illegal workers. In Israel, illegals often either don't work or work like "nomads", meaning that they have different jobs every time.

In short, the situations are not really comparable. What is comparable, however, is that neither the U.S. nor Israel have a moral obligation to pamper illegal immigrants, or even to allow them to stay. Not sure, though, if your thread is actually serious about the differences between these countries or just another thread for Israel-bashing. In the first case, I'm totally down to engage in a discussion. In the second case... nope.

I really have to object to those guys calling themselves Jewish, though.

I really have to object to you calling yourself Jewish. I wouldn't count you in a minyan, but then again, you'd never go to (legitimate) shul anyway, so it doesn't really matter.

[DavidB.]

You are literally crazy, your worldview is literally crazy, and I'm not going to take the effort to reply to your hogwash once again. I'm going to put you on ignore because your baseless accusations go too far, and I'm sure you will not regret that I'll be doing so. Goodbye.

[DavidB.]

  "race traitor"

Please show me where I used these words. Tip: I didn't. Jews are not a "race". Only nazis think Jews are a race.

Ag takes the ideal of cosmopolitanism to its logical conclusion.  You don't need to agree (obviously I'm far far more sympathetic than you, but I'm not sure I would, either) but surely you can step outside of your own biases and understand why and how he believes what he does?

I understand MalaspinaGold's worldview, even though we don't agree on almost everything, but ag's worldview... nope, I don't understand that. I also don't feel the urge to try.

[DavidB.]

This thread has totally derailed. Jacobtm needs to be awarded the "official best troll of the week" prize.

[DavidB.]

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You don't seem to understand that I myself, as a Jew in a big European city (which is not the same as in America), am forced to be in the minority. Talk about "privilege"? What "privilege" do I have by not being able to walk through my own multicultural, poor neighborhood with a yarmulke, or with my necklace with a magen david, without the chance of being harassed by groups of teenage guys hanging around, without feeling self-conscious all the time? That I don't notice people's strange, often hostile looks when I do wear my necklace or my kippa outside my neighborhood? And I'm quite a tough, strong guy, while many in my community aren't. Not complaining about this, just pointing out some basic facts.

Obviously I understand the urge many Jews have to show solidarity with other people who are (deemed) oppressed. And I'll stand by other oppressed people, provided that they don't hate me for who I am. But I get the impression some people think everything is A-OK with Jews now, and we can "move on to other oppressed groups" or something like that. That's not the case. Israel is continuously under attack: Hamas' anti-Semitism is not something that could have targeted any nation, it's a typical anti-Jewish thing, just the same as when the nazis wanted to wipe us out. Meanwhile, the situation in Europe is becoming insufferable for many Jews - just look at the aliyah rates from France.

I don't understand how a Jew could forget that the Shoa was not about discriminating some random minority, it was actually about discriminating Jews. That the pogroms and the ghettos weren't just policies against some random minority, it was actually about discriminating and killing Jews. We need to stand together, because the anti-Semitic poison hasn't magically gone away, it still exists and it's becoming worse and worse. However, nowadays, for many "cosmopolitan" Jews who lack any understanding of (and pride in) the precious heritage of their people, when it comes to making priorities, other Jews come last. And that's what I don't get. If we don't stand with each other, then absolutely nobody will stand with us, which is even clear here in Europe. I totally understand if people think that there should be a two-state solution in the interest of Israel and blah blah blah, even if I totally disagree with it. But I don't understand if people simply don't care about Jewish pain, about Jewish lives, about Jewish rights, or even actively try to deny their fellow Jews basic rights.

[DavidB.]

picture of immigrants

Regardless of one's opinion on African immigrants in Israel, you're aware that this Facebook page is run by crazy "traditionalists" who believe that "the Jews" have successfully conspired to inflict mass immigration on Western Europe in order to destroy "native European" cultures? That this page is run by people who think "white genocide" is an actual thing (and that "racism" is a code word for "anti-white"), and accuse Jews of spreading "cultural marxism"? That "the Jews" are pro-immigration everywhere, in order to make the "European race" weaker, but not in Israel? Essentially, these are the people who happen to make me seriously consider agreeing with Antonio, at least for a few seconds or so.

[DavidB.]

picture of immigrants

Regardless of one's opinion on African immigrants in Israel, you're aware that this Facebook page is run by crazy "traditionalists" who believe that "the Jews" have successfully conspired to inflict mass immigration on Western Europe in order to destroy "native European" cultures? That this page is run by people who think "white genocide" is an actual thing (and that "racism" is a code word for "anti-white"), and accuse Jews of spreading "cultural marxism"? That "the Jews" are pro-immigration everywhere, in order to make the "European race" weaker, but not in Israel? Essentially, these are the people who happen to make me seriously consider agreeing with Antonio, at least for a few seconds or so.

At this point in time Israel has not yet learned how to be multicultural. And I think Europeans are going to be part of the throes of that transformation, which must take place. Israel is not going to be the monolithic Jewish society it once was in the last century. Europeans are going to be at the centre of that. It’s a huge transformation for Israel to make. They are now going into a multicultural mode and Europeans will be resented because of their leading role. But without that leading role and without that transformation, Israel will not survive.

Okay, if you genuinely want to be the guy who thinks it's funny to echo stupid things from an anti-Semitic Facebook page, it's time to put you on ignore. Buh-bye, crazy racist.