Why do quite many homosexuals vote Republican? (user search)
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  Why do quite many homosexuals vote Republican? (search mode)
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Author Topic: Why do quite many homosexuals vote Republican?  (Read 10756 times)
Marokai Backbeat
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E: -7.42, S: -7.39

« on: July 30, 2012, 05:04:45 PM »

Self loathing. Not to single them out, of course. American voters are a self-loathing bunch in general.
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Marokai Backbeat
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*****
Posts: 17,477
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Political Matrix
E: -7.42, S: -7.39

« Reply #1 on: July 30, 2012, 06:56:23 PM »

Self loathing. Not to single them out, of course. American voters are a self-loathing bunch in general.

You sound like opebo.

A broken watch, etc.
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Marokai Backbeat
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Posts: 17,477
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Political Matrix
E: -7.42, S: -7.39

« Reply #2 on: July 31, 2012, 06:01:21 AM »
« Edited: July 31, 2012, 06:03:57 AM by Marokai Béliqueux »

Just read the first page. Not gonna bother with the rest. The stupidity hurt my brain.

Maybe, just maybe, and I know this is crazy but hear me out... gays are actually individual people with their own political thoughts besides one single issue. Maybe not all gays are stero-typical effeminate hippie pofters. Maybe some of them cares strongly about defense, maybe some gays like guns, maybe some gays even care about the economy without subscribing to an Social Democratic agenda.

But what do I know. It's probably just self-loathing.

"Mister Generic Republican may not much like my existence and doesn't support me and my partner having any rights, recognition, or protection under the law, but I sure do like his views on the Second Amendment!"

If you can actually take something like that seriously, then God bless you, because you're a special kind of person.

I'm generally not a person that likes hearing the "it's so much more complicated" card when it comes to voting intentions. There are a few simple black and white things about voting that either consistently make sense, or they don't. If you claim to care about certain issues very high on your list of political priorities, and then don't vote for them, most people would rightly consider you a total moron.

No candidate is ever perfect for the individual voter, especially in the good old US of A, but if, for instance, Joe Average thinks union rights is important and hates infringement on them, but decides to consistently vote for candidates that infringe on them (as was represented in the recent Wisconsin recall election) then the only explanations for that are ignorance or evidently not caring that much about union rights to begin with. This isn't a difficult concept, it's the basis of a lot of conversations around here. "Why do you vote for Republicans if you support our welfare state?" "Why do you vote for old lobbyist insiders when you say you care about 'throwing the bums out'?" "Why do you support conservative Republicans if you claim to care about protecting abortion?"

They're good questions, because you shouldn't, shouldn't, and shouldn't. At least, not if you actually care about what you claim to care about and are at all consistent of an individual. All of that is besides the point, but it's worth mentioning because the only reason you wouldn't stick around to vote for something you should vote for or claim you will vote for is because it turns out, you don't really care or know that much to begin with. Contrary to niceties that make people sound like wise nuanced individuals, there is a right or wrong way to vote depending on who you are and what you care about.

Which is what brings me to being gay and voting for a political party as right-wing as the Republican Party. Being gay isn't just an "issue," it's who you, as a person, are. And no, I'm not particularly interested in hearing a long bulls**t diatribe about how being gay doesn't at all define anyone as a person and that it's just a sexual preference completely separate from everything else. It's an identity, full stop. And with that identity comes a set of unfortunate realities about the current world we live in.

One being, the Republican Party as a whole is not interested in defending the rights of gay people as people. At least, not yet. And unlike just deciding not to be specifically one-issue on broader voting preferences like with abortion, or union rights, etc, being gay and voting for a conservative Republican requires the type of compartmentalization that I just can't respect whatsoever. You're doing a disservice to who you are by separating yourself from your own identity when you shouldn't, and in a way that doesn't happen with other issues. It implies a level of prioritization that lists your civil rights as a minority group low on what you care about. And if you're a queer that doesn't care about your rights as a person, then I don't respect you or your voting decisions whatsoever, and I see no reason why I should.

I'd say the same thing to women not voting for women's rights or blacks being opposed to the civil rights movement.  If you oppose your own rights be it intentionally or unintentionally, you're a bad person, and if you don't care about them, you're just as bad as people who are actively opposing them. There's not a chance in hell I'll ever apologize for thinking of such people as bizarrely twisted individuals who either don't care about themselves or don't realize the harm they're doing to other people just like them.

Look; I don't like you much, but you're not a bad person. You're nice and also incredibly lucky with your position in life, but this has nothing to do with your constant crusade to poke at Social Democracy in literally any way that you can. It has nothing to do with it whatsoever. This is about the kind of mindset a person has to have to literally vote against themselves as people. It's not about voting for union rights or taxes, it's a bigger deal than that, and I don't think people realize what a psychologically damaging (or just damaged) worldview one has to have to be able to do that. You can flit around about how much you super duper hate Social Democrats, but on this one I have no way of viewing that type of behavior as anything but either supremely ignorant or self loathing.
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Marokai Backbeat
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Posts: 17,477
United States


Political Matrix
E: -7.42, S: -7.39

« Reply #3 on: July 31, 2012, 07:44:49 AM »

So any gay person who doesn't vote strictly based on the candidates' view on gay marriage is obviously a total moron. Whatever their views may be on any other issues, they are f**king not allowed to take those views into consideration. If they vote for a candidate that, god forbid, opposes their right to marry, obviously they are total dumbasses that hate themselves.

It's not just about the right to marry and the rights that come along with it, it's about being recognized and protected by the State in any way at all. About being given the expressed understanding that the government recognizes who you are as a separate and distinct group that is protected via hate crime laws and given all the respect that entails. The national Republican Party as it stands right now is interested in none of those things and no self-respecting gay man or woman should be complicit in that.

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Union rights and the protection of the welfare state is infinitely more important than some crusty old grandma's views on boys kissing. I couldn't care less what your personal view on that is, but one is objectively more important and impactful than the other.

And before you hop on here thinking you have an excellent rebuttal, the gay point of view is not equally invalid. One is about one old traditional group's moral objections to other people doing things entirely separate from them, the other is about someone from that group being given equal recognition and protection under the law.

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Oh please. I hate this country's politics and don't view it as anything close to that.

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I'm going to go out on a limb and suggest that I as a gay adult understand being gay better than you do.

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Gay people who vote Republican suck because I don't understand them. They SUCK.[/quote]

Is that really all that you got out of that paragraph?

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But it's not just about gay marriage. It's about the broader treatment of a minority group in every way the State can affect them. Respecting them, protecting them in criminal statute and the privacy of their bedrooms, and affording them equal rights in all things. I can understand voting for a waffly Democrat who goes back and forth on the issue, but not for a conservative Republican in the vein of a Rick Santorum.

The ability to do that implies you either don't care about your rights as a minority group that much or at all, or that you have a remarkable ability to separate yourself from your identity when you walk into a voting booth. It's the sort of battered wife mindset that I can't imagine is anything but psychologically damaged and damaging. You're not only hurting yourself but also everyone else that is deeply hurt by a socially conservative agenda as the supposed side dish to the tax cutting main course. There is no justifiable way to "take other things into account" when it is the rights and respect of your own minority group on the line.

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Did a 14 year old really just call me "son"?
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Marokai Backbeat
Marokai Blue
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*****
Posts: 17,477
United States


Political Matrix
E: -7.42, S: -7.39

« Reply #4 on: July 31, 2012, 09:18:15 AM »

Oh Swedish Cheese, we both know that you fit the stereotype far better than I do.
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