MA: Mideast Budget 2012 (Statute)

[🐒Gods of Prosperity🔱🐲💸]

What do people think about basing the income tax rates on a real life state from the region? If you want to be able to see estimates from me without a very long wait, that'd be the way to do it.

Oh hey - like a flat tax rate?  Just like I've been saying.

MI, IN and IL have flat taxes; the others have more.
Here is a list of the tax rates for every state.

[Chancellor Tanterterg]

What do people think about basing the income tax rates on a real life state from the region? If you want to be able to see estimates from me without a very long wait, that'd be the way to do it.

Oh hey - like a flat tax rate?  Just like I've been saying.

I still would not support a flat tax.  Plus, I think my amendment/proposal is a better solution

[Queen Mum Inks.LWC]

What do people think about basing the income tax rates on a real life state from the region? If you want to be able to see estimates from me without a very long wait, that'd be the way to do it.

Oh hey - like a flat tax rate?  Just like I've been saying.

MI, IN and IL have flat taxes; the others have more.
Here is a list of the tax rates for every state.

I thought Missouri and Ohio did as well... apparently I was incorrect in that.

[Talleyrand]

What do people think about basing the income tax rates on a real life state from the region? If you want to be able to see estimates from me without a very long wait, that'd be the way to do it.

Oh hey - like a flat tax rate?  Just like I've been saying.

I still would not support a flat tax.  Plus, I think my amendment/proposal is a better solution

I agree with Mr. X. But some states have decent, while not extreme progressive rates in the region- like Maryland, Ohio, and Wisconsin.

[🐒Gods of Prosperity🔱🐲💸]

What do people think about basing the income tax rates on a real life state from the region? If you want to be able to see estimates from me without a very long wait, that'd be the way to do it.

Oh hey - like a flat tax rate?  Just like I've been saying.

MI, IN and IL have flat taxes; the others have more.
Here is a list of the tax rates for every state.

I thought Missouri and Ohio did as well... apparently I was incorrect in that.

Missouri's is almost flat, since the highest bracket starts at $9K.

[Queen Mum Inks.LWC]

What do people think about basing the income tax rates on a real life state from the region? If you want to be able to see estimates from me without a very long wait, that'd be the way to do it.

Oh hey - like a flat tax rate?  Just like I've been saying.

MI, IN and IL have flat taxes; the others have more.
Here is a list of the tax rates for every state.

I thought Missouri and Ohio did as well... apparently I was incorrect in that.

Missouri's is almost flat, since the highest bracket starts at $9K.

That's right - I remember that now.

[Queen Mum Inks.LWC]

So, no one answered my question.  Do you want a vote before or after the GM's analysis?  (This is mainly aimed at whoever introduced the amendment... I can't remember right now)

[Chancellor Tanterterg]

I would prefer a vote on my amendment before the analysis.  I think there is already pretty solid support for the compromise. 

[🐒Gods of Prosperity🔱🐲💸]

just to be clear, I haven't yet figured out how to analyze a regional tax plan that isn't either a flat tax or at least somewhat based on RL rates.

[tmthforu94]

just to be clear, I haven't yet figured out how to analyze a regional tax plan that isn't either a flat tax or at least somewhat based on RL rates.

I'm assuming the gas tax will have a pretty substantial effect on our budget, considering how low it was originally. I'd like to see just how much that would have an impact, as that'll determine what needs done here in order to get a balanced budget.

Thank you!

[🐒Gods of Prosperity🔱🐲💸]

the gas and diesel tax revenue increases from 3.1 billion to 17.5 billion (14.4 billion increase). However, revenue from other sources can be expected to decrease by about 900 million due to lower consumer spending on other products. So, net increase of 13.5 billion.

[tmthforu94]

the gas and diesel tax revenue increases from 3.1 billion to 17.5 billion (14.4 billion increase). However, revenue from other sources can be expected to decrease by about 900 million due to lower consumer spending on other products. So, net increase of 13.5 billion.

This bring our deficit down to $1.64 billion! With us being so close to a balanced budget, I won't allow any increases to the income or corporate tax now, as I find it unnecessary.

[Talleyrand]

the gas and diesel tax revenue increases from 3.1 billion to 17.5 billion (14.4 billion increase). However, revenue from other sources can be expected to decrease by about 900 million due to lower consumer spending on other products. So, net increase of 13.5 billion.

This was the bill with gas at 45 cents and diesel at 50 cents, right? Either way, I'm very happy with this result.

[Chancellor Tanterterg]

the gas and diesel tax revenue increases from 3.1 billion to 17.5 billion (14.4 billion increase). However, revenue from other sources can be expected to decrease by about 900 million due to lower consumer spending on other products. So, net increase of 13.5 billion.

This bring our deficit down to $1.64 billion! With us being so close to a balanced budget, I won't allow any increases to the income or corporate tax now, as I find it unnecessary.

I don't know that I can support a budget that doesn't at least include some increases in the regional income and corporate tax rates.  I believe that the regional income tax rates and corporate tax rates are simply too low under the unamended budget proposal and I would urge my fellow members of the Mideast Assembly to oppose the unamended budget.  If Governor Tmthforu94 will agree to some additional concessions on the regional income tax rates (along with those in my amendment) than I would be willing to make some concessions on the corporate tax rates (though the concessions would have to be proportional).

The regional income tax rates (and to a lesser degree the corporate tax rates) are simply too low, I don't feel the upper-income brackets would be paying their fair share of the regional taxes under the unamended budget proposal.  I think that the amendment I had proposed is a fair compromise that requires both sides to make real concessions.  Supporting the unamended budget would require Assemblymen Gass, Assemblyman TexasDem, and myself to essentially give away the farm for free and that is not something that I am willing to do.  It would be no different than if I refused to support any budget that did not include the original/pre-compromise income and corporate tax rates that I proposed.  

I would urge Governor Tmthforu94 to reconsider as this sort of ideological rigidity will not lead to the passage of a balanced budget, the fact is that neither the Governor nor the Assembly majority are in a position to be taking a "my way or the high way" on this issue (plus such an approach is generally counter-productive imo).  The Assembly majority can simply respond in kind to the Governor's new position and say that we won't "allow" a budget without income and corporate tax increases.  So then we don't get a budget because of ideological rigidity and everyone loses.  Neither of us can pass a budget without the other's support, so we are equally capable of killing each other's proposals.  The only thing that can pass is a compromise everyone can live with.  Don't get me wrong, I am open to smaller increases for certain brackets and I am very happy with the progress that has been made, but I do feel strongly about this.  I also think that folding to pressure like this would set a terrible precedent for future negotiations.  The path to prosperity is one of pragmatic compromise, not ideological rigidity and we must all remember that.

[Gass3268]

Would anybody consider a 5 cent bag tax? They have it everywhere around DC. It would help bring in a little revenue and it would also help encourage people you use their own reusable bags. 

[Gass3268]

Also I think we can still raise the income/corporate taxes, but it doesn't need to be as much as much as previously proposed.

Lastly, if we choose not to go the tax route, how do we get that last 1.64 billion?

[Chancellor Tanterterg]

Also I think we can still raise the income/corporate taxes, but it doesn't need to be as much as much as previously proposed.

[tmthforu94]

Our economy is already fragile enough as is - I don't believe we should be pushing for more tax hikes when we already are on track to having a balanced budget. There were some pretty lofty increases in the original compromise - I reverse my support for those now because those type of increases are unnecessary in reaching a balanced budget. Why do people want to increase taxes when we don't need to? Let's leave more money in individual's pockets so that they can go out there and invest in our economy and create more jobs.

Now, I'd be willing to go back to the drawing board on tax rates and come out with a fairer system than the current one, but I'm not going to continue to pound the wealthy with more taxes - the progressive tax laid down by the federal government is ridiculously high...are people forgetting that?

If these type of tax rates (federal and regional combined) were actually passed in RL, it'd simply cripple the economy. I don't want that to happen.

[tmthforu94]

Lastly, if we choose not to go the tax route, how do we get that last 1.64 billion?

I still have my proposed sales tax adjustment.

[tmthforu94]

 Increasing the sales tax to 6.0% would overall increase revenue by $3 billion, putting us several billion over a balanced budget, according to GM Shua.

That being said, I introduce:

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[Queen Mum Inks.LWC]

OK, so other than Tmthforu94's sales tax amendment, what amendments do members still want brought to a vote?

[Gass3268]

I say that we vote on the Governor's amendment then go forward and pass this baby!

[Chancellor Tanterterg]

I say that we vote on the Governor's amendment then go forward and pass this baby!

[Queen Mum Inks.LWC]

Voting is now open on the following amendment.  Members will vote AYE, NAY, or ABSTAIN.  This will be a 24-hour vote.

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[Lambsbread]

Nay