in which city would you rather reside?

[Starbucks Union Thug HokeyPuck]

I've lived in Montgomery County, PA.  It's nice. 

[Starbucks Union Thug HokeyPuck]

I've lived in Montgomery County, PA.  It's nice. 

it is probably the least bad of the options. 

The 'burbs closest to Philly actually resemble Northeast Philly neighborhoods.  Certainly more diverse and a better community feeling than the Jersey side of the river. 

[Starbucks Union Thug HokeyPuck]

I've lived in Montgomery County, PA.  It's nice. 

it is probably the least bad of the options. 

The 'burbs closest to Philly actually resemble Northeast Philly neighborhoods.  Certainly more diverse and a better community feeling than the Jersey side of the river. 

It depends. If you're out in western Montco, you'd think you were in Central PA. On the other hand, some townships in the more populated areas of the county look like NE Philly. Others, definitely not (ironically, many areas along the Philly border are unlike the NE. Much wealthier).

Of course, but anything you would need is in East MontCo.  I've lived in Conshohocken specifically, and I found it to be a very endearing town.  My dad relocated there to live with my stepmom around 1998.  None of the young adults in the area seem to know what a rock song is, but that's hardly a serious knock.  Their 4th of July is fantastic.  Conshohocken Day is a lot of fun.  The restaurants along Fayette Ave. range from good to great.  There are a ton of fields to play football/baseball at, and the police don't get all pissy about it.  I head west to get to the Poconos or camping grounds at times, but a good 90% of the population lives in East MontCo so that's what I'm basing my judgment of the county on. 

I didn't even mention Norristown, which is a fine little edge city.  It reminds me of a Camden that didn't decay so badly. 

[Starbucks Union Thug HokeyPuck]

no votes for okc?

That's worse than Kabul or Baghdad.

Downtown looks fine.



Not dissimilar to your average American city.  But get out of that 10 block radius, and I'm sure you will find this guy lurking...

[Starbucks Union Thug HokeyPuck]

Is there even a comparison between Bucks and Montgomery?  MontCo makes Bucks look like Oklahoma. 

[Starbucks Union Thug HokeyPuck]

I have an aunt and uncle in Bucks County, which, from what I can tell is very white bread suburbia. Is Montgomery County pretty similar or is one considered better than the other? 

Montco is much much much better.  At least the parts close-in to Philly are.  There's a greater preponderance of older towns with more character and better transit access- places like Cheltenham, Jenkintown, Ambler, Lower Merion/Narberth, Conshohocken, Norristown, etc.  Even the sprawlscape edge city that is King of Prussia (Upper Merion) is at least more of a destination than anything you'll find in Bucks, and hey it's close to Valley Forge.

Whereas Bucks has Levittown.  No, seriously, the actual Levittown.  Biiiig difference there.

Once you get past Lansdale into northwest Montgomery... the advantages dissipate.  Upper Bucks and upper Montgomery are both quite exurban and McMansiony, and if anything upper Bucks might actually be a tiny bit nicer.  But I'm not about to spend much time in either.

No one really lives up there, though.  It'd be like judging an entire neighborhood based on one kooky neighbor who lives up on the hill.  Nobody who lives in the great parts of MontCo goes there. 

[Starbucks Union Thug HokeyPuck]

Whereas Bucks has Levittown.  No, seriously, the actual Levittown.  Biiiig difference there.

The "actual" Levittown isn't on Long Island? That one was built first, I believe.

True, there are two actual Levittowns and it appears the Long Island one was built first.

The story behind the third Levittown- Willingboro, New Jersey- is really pretty horrible in so many ways.  I mean, the racism lurking behind all the Levittowns is pretty well known, but how it played out in Willingboro is especially galling:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Willingboro_Township,_New_Jersey

I currently live in the town next to Willingboro.  It's fine now.  There were all kinds of problems, yes, in the 1960s.  As soon as integration was forced by the James case, the town flourished.  It's a nice example of how successful and peaceful an American community can be once you get all of the racists out of there and sell the properties to good hard working people.  Today it's 75% African-American and doing swell.  A great place to point to when your average NJ racist likes to bring up places like Camden and Newark and claim that minorities, rather than economic decay, ruined them.  

[Starbucks Union Thug HokeyPuck]

Whereas Bucks has Levittown.  No, seriously, the actual Levittown.  Biiiig difference there.

The "actual" Levittown isn't on Long Island? That one was built first, I believe.

True, there are two actual Levittowns and it appears the Long Island one was built first.

The story behind the third Levittown- Willingboro, New Jersey- is really pretty horrible in so many ways.  I mean, the racism lurking behind all the Levittowns is pretty well known, but how it played out in Willingboro is especially galling:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Willingboro_Township,_New_Jersey

I currently live in the town next to Willingboro.  It's fine now.  There were all kinds of problems, yes, in the 1960s.  As soon as integration was forced by the James case, the town flourished.  It's a nice example of how successful and peaceful an American community can be once you get all of the racists out of there and sell the properties to good hard working people.  Today it's 75% African-American and doing swell.  A great place to point to when your average NJ racist likes to bring up places like Camden and Newark and claim that minorities, rather than economic decay, ruined them.  

I dunno, I think it's still a pretty galling historical example of "white flight"- especially naked because the racists leaving were so obviously leaving only because blacks were moving in, not because of the usual excuses of "better schools" or "we want spacious yards" or whatever flimsy cover they'd usually come up with.

And, anyway, I'd rather point to places like South Orange and Maplewood- which are actually integrated, and fairly wealthy to boot.

I thought the bit about Levitt refusing to donate any more schools once they went back to the original name of Willingboro was a nice touch of vindictive a**holery as well.

It's just racist flight, white flight is a misnomer.  The more racists that get away from the cities and isolate themselves in Dullsville, USA, the better.  Yes, back in the day most whites were racist and they fled.  But those who weren't certainly stuck around; and the non-racist whites, which constitute the majority outside of the traditionalist Southern areas, don't flee to the 'burbs anymore. 

I guess you could say that "white flight", IMO, was a good thing.  I'm very glad that those cowards were scared away and the non-racists and minorities stood their ground and lived where they want to live. 

[Starbucks Union Thug HokeyPuck]

Is there even a comparison between Bucks and Montgomery?  MontCo makes Bucks look like Oklahoma.  

In terms of lifestyle (in most places) and politically, yes. Bucks is funny though. I have family in the Lehigh Valley and we have to cut through Western Upper Bucks to get to their house. It is pretty rural. Again, you'd think you were in central parts of the state. Eastern Upper Bucks though has more affluent areas, not to mention the vast culturally different spots like New Hope.

And I agree that Conshy would probably be better for BRTD even though he'd like that Norristown has much more of an edge. I could see him really enjoying saying "Conshy," too.

Ooooooo I totally forgot about New Hope.  New Hope is beautiful.  I've been there a bunch of times for the Bucks County Playhouse's production of The Rocky Horror Picture Show around Halloween.  It's really wonderful in the fall.  













These are just the type of PA towns that I love.  Bethlehem is another one like this.