What would you take for you to vote for the opposite party that you generally lean?

[The Economy is Getting Worse]

What would you take for you to vote for the opposite party that you usually lean? That is, if you usually vote Democrat, what would it take for you to ever vote for a Republican? If you are a Republican, what would it take for you to ever vote for a Democrat?

While I'm not a Republican, I'm probably voting for Trump in 2024 over Biden. The main scenario where I'm voting Democrat is if I lived in Florida, for 2026 governor, given how much damage authoritarian DeSantis has done (I probably would still vote Republican for 2024 Senate, as horrible of a human being Rick Scott is). The legislature is still safe Republican, and should check any Democratic governor.

[Aurelius2]

Rob DeSwampAss gets the nom. I've voted in 4 elections and in all the last 3 I voted straight R. I fully intend to do so again in 2024 unless he is the nominee.

[The Economy is Getting Worse]

Rob DeSwampAss gets the nom. I've voted in 4 elections and in all the last 3 I voted straight R. I fully intend to do so again in 2024 unless he is the nominee.

You mean you would vote Biden over DeSantis? How would you vote downballot? (I personally would vote DeSantis over Biden, though it's like a -100 vs a -110. However, if the opponent were someone like Tony Evers, or even Hillary Clinton, I would vote D over DeSantis, especially if I knew the Senate were going Republican).

DeSantis, unlike Trump, actually scares me as someone who could successfully push authoritarian policies through the political system.

Also, how would you vote if you lived in FL for governor 2026?

[Aurelius2]

Rob DeSwampAss gets the nom. I've voted in 4 elections and in all the last 3 I voted straight R. I fully intend to do so again in 2024 unless he is the nominee.

You mean you would vote Biden over DeSantis? How would you vote downballot? (I personally would vote DeSantis over Biden, though it's like a -100 vs a -110. However, if the opponent were someone like Tony Evers, or even Hillary Clinton, I would vote D over DeSantis, especially if I knew the Senate were going Republican).

DeSantis, unlike Trump, actually scares me as someone who could successfully push authoritarian policies through Congress.

Also, how would you vote if you lived in FL for governor 2026?

I deeply dislike the hardcore socon side that Ron has shown lately. Huge, huge step down from Trump in that regard. Massive turnoff, and it's my least favorite part of the GOP. Usually I am able to overlook it because I'm much closer to the Republicans on basically everything else, the candidate isn't emphasizing it nearly as much, and/or it's obvious that it's just empty talk meant to pander to the evangelical vote. For DeSantis on the other hand, he's shown that he actually acts on it, and not only that but it's also clearly the driving impetus behind his campaign at this point. And for me, the anti-gay stuff is personal. He barely cares about most of the other things I care about, and in this area he's actively terrible, so strong chance I hold back my vomit and grudgingly vote for Biden. Not only is he bad on the stuff he's a hardcore socon on, he's also recently revealed himself as an authoritarian across the board, and a nanny-statist on a level I haven't seen from a serious Republican candidate in a very long time. I also like my candidates to not appear superimposed over a Nazi symbol in a campaign video.

Trump ranges from vexing to infuriating on his personal drama and his nonsense about "stolen elections", but I agree with him on 90% of policy issues, and frankly on foreign policy the blob is so strong that they'll get their way half the time regardless, and I find them at least as disagreeable as Trump on fopo, just in the other direction.

I would still vote R on every race downballot. As for Gov, DeSantis will not be eligible to run again until 2030, so presumably I would vote for whichever Republican gets the nom in 2026, unless they are a vile RDS clone.

[The Economy is Getting Worse]

I would still vote R on every race downballot. As for Gov, DeSantis will not be eligible to run again until 2030, so presumably I would vote for whichever Republican gets the nom in 2026, unless they are a vile RDS clone.

Who would you vote for if DeSantis changed the constitution to run for a third term? He has already eliminated the "resign to run" rule.

[Aurelius2]

I would still vote R on every race downballot. As for Gov, DeSantis will not be eligible to run again until 2030, so presumably I would vote for whichever Republican gets the nom in 2026, unless they are a vile RDS clone.

Who would you vote for if DeSantis changed the constitution to run for a third term? He has already eliminated the "resign to run" rule.

The Democrat. He must be destroyed and made irrelevant.

[Alben Barkley]

It would probably take something like Democrats endorsing NAMBLA.

[Ferguson97]

I'm assuming that you mean excluding scenarios where the parties "swap" platforms/ideologies.

The truthful answer is none. If the Democratic candidate were like Roy Moore-levels of bad or something, I'd just vote third party or abstain. I could never bring myself to vote for a Republican.

[Alben Barkley]

I'm assuming that you mean excluding scenarios where the parties "swap" platforms/ideologies.

The truthful answer is none. If the Democratic candidate were like Roy Moore-levels of bad or something, I'd just vote third party or abstain. I could never bring myself to vote for a Republican.

I would vote for the Republican equivalent of Doug Jones over the Democratic equivalent of Roy Moore, absolutely. And frankly I think it is a bad double standard to expect people who normally lean Republican to do this but not be willing to do it yourself.

[Vosem]

Usually it's not so much the Democrats that win my vote as the Republicans that lose it. Anyway, I split my ballot about evenly between the two major parties in 2018, but otherwise have voted mostly or entirely Republican with the occasional Libertarian vote mixed in.

I probably have somewhat lower standards for Democrats than Republicans, actually -- because both parties will rule America about half the time, it makes sense for me to vote for better-than-replacement Democrats, who will then hopefully have more of a voice in their parties, even if I would find a Republican with the same views very distasteful. In the past I've used gun rights as a good litmus test, with people like Manchin/Donnelly/Heitkamp getting my hypothetical vote so that the Democratic Senate caucus is more pro-gun-ownership, though as the conservative victory on this issue gets more entrenched and it becomes less relevant I'll probably need to find something else.

[The Economy is Getting Worse]

Usually it's not so much the Democrats that win my vote as the Republicans that lose it. Anyway, I split my ballot about evenly between the two major parties in 2018, but otherwise have voted mostly or entirely Republican with the occasional Libertarian vote mixed in.

I probably have somewhat lower standards for Democrats than Republicans, actually -- because both parties will rule America about half the time, it makes sense for me to vote for better-than-replacement Democrats, who will then hopefully have more of a voice in their parties, even if I would find a Republican with the same views very distasteful. In the past I've used gun rights as a good litmus test, with people like Manchin/Donnelly/Heitkamp getting my hypothetical vote so that the Democratic Senate caucus is more pro-gun-ownership, though as the conservative victory on this issue gets more entrenched and it becomes less relevant I'll probably need to find something else.

This isn't necessarily true: Democrats had the House for 40 years from 1954 to 1994.

It looked like Republicans were due to hold the Senate for a whole generation, but Democrats are holding up a lot better than expected there now.

[TML]

For starters, the Republican Party would have to move in the direction of conservative parties in Europe and/or Canada on a number of issues (i.e. supporting universal health care, accepting the scientific consensus on climate change, etc.).

[I spent the winter writing songs about getting better]

The only way I could possibly see myself voting for a Republican is if I lived in a city with partisan municipal elections and my choice was between a reasonable person running as a Republican and an utter fool and/or lunatic. Right now I'm actually basically always voting for the right in Minneapolis elections because the progressives on the council now are seemingly intent on completely ruining the city via things like an already tried right next door and proven to be disastrous rent control policy paired with NIMBYism (under the guise of "standing up to big developers!") and making Uber and Lyft unaffordable in the city and possibly driving them out altogether (thus hurting the drivers, the same people they're claiming to be trying to help.) The "establishment" faction is pretty lousy too, but considering that they aren't actively trying to make the city unlivable I don't have much of a choice. My favorite Minneapolis City Councilor is actually Andrew Johnson, who is generally reasonable and opposes the insanity pushed by the "progressives" but doesn't outright align with the "establishment" side probably because he knows how much they suck too and is known for actually engaging constituents on social media regularly and just seems like an overall nice and friendly guy. Unfortunately he's not running for re-election.

But those aren't Republicans, just relatively moderate Democrats, and actually are in the greater context arguably to the left of the median Democrat, Jacob Frey for example would be seen as a progressive if he were in state or federal politics and is a staunch supporter of that progressive agenda Walz just passed but he's aligned with them here (this can perhaps be evidenced by one of his proteges who I put in that "guess if these legislators are Democrats or Republicans" post being regarded as a progressive in the Minnesota legislature.) You do have people like candidate Victor Martinez who is basically a complete DINO and a stealth Republican in the mold of Rubén Díaz Sr, as well as Michael Rainville who is more of a legitimate moderate Democrat than a conservative DINO but regardless is still well to the right of the median voter in Minneapolis and probably would be even in DFL suburbs. And a scenario where Republicans are actually competitive but the Democrats are backing the type of psychos we have here is pretty far fetched.

One actual election where I guess this would technically happen is that last Seattle City Attorney one, but in that case it was still nonpartisan and the "Republican" was a Biden-backing RINO while that crazy lady who lost never claimed to be a Democrat and actually was less supportive of Biden and Hillary than her "Republican" opponent, so not really an example.

[OSR stands with Israel]

For starters, the Republican Party would have to move in the direction of conservative parties in Europe and/or Canada on a number of issues (i.e. supporting universal health care, accepting the scientific consensus on climate change, etc.).

The Canadian Tories aren’t really more moderate than the GOP:

1. The Canadian Tory party only support single payer because Left of center governments succeeded in implementing them. If LBJ was successful in passing Medicare for all on 1965, the GOP also would be pro single payer

2. The Canadian Tories are arguably to the right of the GOP on environmental issues . Keep in mind Stephen Harper was their prime minister for 10 years , being pro pipeline is one of their core issues for a while and currently eliminating the carbon taxes is one of their main promises so it’s false to say the Canadian Tories are really any much to the left of the GOP on environmental issue

3. The Canadian Tories are led by someone who supported the Trucker Protests , and the Alberta Tories are led by someone who passed a bill that lets her nullify certain federal laws .

4. The Canadian Tories are led by someone who wants to implement Trump’s schedule F plan but without replacing the civil service employees he plans to fire as he plans to eliminate those postions all together .

5. Even on abortion , the Tories only don’t support banning it because they did try to ban it in 1989 but their efforts failed .

Like the Polievre Canadian Tories aren’t really to the left of the GOP at all , and if you reversed both parties you really wouldn’t see much change in either as the only issues the Canadian Tories are more liberal on then the GOP(healthcare , and abortion), they are out of convience .


Even the UK Tories , they are to the right of the GOP on immigration, and arguably trans issues too though yeah they are more moderate on most of the issues .

[RI]

Locally, if the R is an election denier or wildly unqualified and the D is more focused on economic/practical issues than social ones, I'll vote for the D. I think I usually end up voting for the D about 30-40% of the time.

[EternalOptimistPopulist]

Republican Party goes back to being the party of neocons and nation building or the party of the rich. Or an economic disaster under a Republican, like 2008. Democrats at the federal level would also have to run more moderate socially. If I was old enough and considering my views now, I could've easily voted Dem any time prior to 2012. Now, if I vote Dem it's likely at the state level.

[Aurelius2]

I probably have somewhat lower standards for Democrats than Republicans, actually -- because both parties will rule America about half the time, it makes sense for me to vote for better-than-replacement Democrats, who will then hopefully have more of a voice in their parties, even if I would find a Republican with the same views very distasteful. In the past I've used gun rights as a good litmus test, with people like Manchin/Donnelly/Heitkamp getting my hypothetical vote so that the Democratic Senate caucus is more pro-gun-ownership, though as the conservative victory on this issue gets more entrenched and it becomes less relevant I'll probably need to find something else.

I used to have this approach, and it's why I voted for Steve Glazer when he ran for state Senate. Then covid rolled around and he was one of the loudest and worst advocates for eternal lockdowns and all sorts of other bad stuff. Not making that mistake again.

[I spent the winter writing songs about getting better]

I probably have somewhat lower standards for Democrats than Republicans, actually -- because both parties will rule America about half the time, it makes sense for me to vote for better-than-replacement Democrats, who will then hopefully have more of a voice in their parties, even if I would find a Republican with the same views very distasteful. In the past I've used gun rights as a good litmus test, with people like Manchin/Donnelly/Heitkamp getting my hypothetical vote so that the Democratic Senate caucus is more pro-gun-ownership, though as the conservative victory on this issue gets more entrenched and it becomes less relevant I'll probably need to find something else.

I used to have this approach, and it's why I voted for Steve Glazer when he ran for state Senate. Then covid rolled around and he was one of the loudest and worst advocates for eternal lockdowns and all sorts of other bad stuff. Not making that mistake again.

No one aside from Arthur Chu who is no longer relevant in the slightest and perhaps a few other Twitter clowns was calling for "eternal" lockdowns.

[Aurelius2]

I probably have somewhat lower standards for Democrats than Republicans, actually -- because both parties will rule America about half the time, it makes sense for me to vote for better-than-replacement Democrats, who will then hopefully have more of a voice in their parties, even if I would find a Republican with the same views very distasteful. In the past I've used gun rights as a good litmus test, with people like Manchin/Donnelly/Heitkamp getting my hypothetical vote so that the Democratic Senate caucus is more pro-gun-ownership, though as the conservative victory on this issue gets more entrenched and it becomes less relevant I'll probably need to find something else.

I used to have this approach, and it's why I voted for Steve Glazer when he ran for state Senate. Then covid rolled around and he was one of the loudest and worst advocates for eternal lockdowns and all sorts of other bad stuff. Not making that mistake again.

No one aside from Arthur Chu who is no longer relevant in the slightest and perhaps a few other Twitter clowns was calling for "eternal" lockdowns.

It's a figure of speech. Unlike every other state except New Mexico, California had true lockdowns that extended into 2021.

[Upper Canada Tory]

For starters, the Republican Party would have to move in the direction of conservative parties in Europe and/or Canada on a number of issues (i.e. supporting universal health care, accepting the scientific consensus on climate change, etc.).

The Canadian Tories aren’t really more moderate than the GOP:

1. The Canadian Tory party only support single payer because Left of center governments succeeded in implementing them. If LBJ was successful in passing Medicare for all on 1965, the GOP also would be pro single payer

2. The Canadian Tories are arguably to the right of the GOP on environmental issues . Keep in mind Stephen Harper was their prime minister for 10 years , being pro pipeline is one of their core issues for a while and currently eliminating the carbon taxes is one of their main promises so it’s false to say the Canadian Tories are really any much to the left of the GOP on environmental issue

3. The Canadian Tories are led by someone who supported the Trucker Protests , and the Alberta Tories are led by someone who passed a bill that lets her nullify certain federal laws .

4. The Canadian Tories are led by someone who wants to implement Trump’s schedule F plan but without replacing the civil service employees he plans to fire as he plans to eliminate those postions all together .

5. Even on abortion , the Tories only don’t support banning it because they did try to ban it in 1989 but their efforts failed .

Like the Polievre Canadian Tories aren’t really to the left of the GOP at all , and if you reversed both parties you really wouldn’t see much change in either as the only issues the Canadian Tories are more liberal on then the GOP(healthcare , and abortion), they are out of convience .


Even the UK Tories , they are to the right of the GOP on immigration, and arguably trans issues too though yeah they are more moderate on most of the issues .

1. This is somewhat debatable. At the provincial level, a lot of Conservative governments were in favour of implementing universal healthcare in the 1960s (eg, John Robarts in Ontario). They were initially against, but switched their stance due to public opinion. When the Medical Care Act of 1966 was passed, out of 97 Conservative and 9 Social Credit MPs, only two voted against it - many abstained or voted in favour. I don't think the GOP would act like this if universal healthcare were being passed in the US.

Your post misses slightly that historically, public opinion has been the main motivator for Canadian Conservatives to accept universal healthcare. Most Conservative voters in Canada would say they want to keep the universal healthcare system, in some cases with slight modifications, while most GOP voters in the USA would oppose a universal healthcare system in the first place.

2. I guess, but I would point out that Mulroney sided with Thatcher in the 1980s on the Montreal Protocol and phasing out CFCs to protect the ozone layer, while Reagan was more sceptical. You're right that Conservatives in Canada are generally pro oil and gas, but they haven't really hesitated to support pro-environmental policies (and I don't see pro-environment policies as being contradictory to right wing views - as I said, even Margaret Thatcher was in favour of a lot of pro-environment policies). The carbon tax is not a good comparison because it's not really a pertinent political issue in the US like it is in Canada. However, Schwarzenegger did implement cap and trade when he was a GOP Governor of California, so it can be argued that Canadian Conservatives are more right wing than that? But then again, even an Albertan Conservative government in the 2000s imposed a cap and a price on some GHG emissions.

3. Again, the trucker protests are not really a good comparison because there is no American equivalent of this.

4. Where did you get this from?

5. This is fair, and polling suggests that views on abortion are almost as varied in Canada as they are in the US.

One issue I'm surprised you didn't mention is immigration. Back in 2017 or so, Trump wanted to emulate the Canadian points system, and back then the Canadian immigration system was viewed as much more successful because it was run relatively well by the Harper government between 2006 and 2015. Also, Reagan gave amnesty to illegal immigrants in the 1980s - Mulroney actually made immigration laws stricter back then. It can be argued that in some respects Canadian Conservatives are more right wing on immigration.

[OSR stands with Israel]

For starters, the Republican Party would have to move in the direction of conservative parties in Europe and/or Canada on a number of issues (i.e. supporting universal health care, accepting the scientific consensus on climate change, etc.).

The Canadian Tories aren’t really more moderate than the GOP:

1. The Canadian Tory party only support single payer because Left of center governments succeeded in implementing them. If LBJ was successful in passing Medicare for all on 1965, the GOP also would be pro single payer

2. The Canadian Tories are arguably to the right of the GOP on environmental issues . Keep in mind Stephen Harper was their prime minister for 10 years , being pro pipeline is one of their core issues for a while and currently eliminating the carbon taxes is one of their main promises so it’s false to say the Canadian Tories are really any much to the left of the GOP on environmental issue

3. The Canadian Tories are led by someone who supported the Trucker Protests , and the Alberta Tories are led by someone who passed a bill that lets her nullify certain federal laws .

4. The Canadian Tories are led by someone who wants to implement Trump’s schedule F plan but without replacing the civil service employees he plans to fire as he plans to eliminate those postions all together .

5. Even on abortion , the Tories only don’t support banning it because they did try to ban it in 1989 but their efforts failed .

Like the Polievre Canadian Tories aren’t really to the left of the GOP at all , and if you reversed both parties you really wouldn’t see much change in either as the only issues the Canadian Tories are more liberal on then the GOP(healthcare , and abortion), they are out of convience .


Even the UK Tories , they are to the right of the GOP on immigration, and arguably trans issues too though yeah they are more moderate on most of the issues .

1. This is somewhat debatable. At the provincial level, a lot of Conservative governments were in favour of implementing universal healthcare in the 1960s (eg, John Robarts in Ontario). They were initially against, but switched their stance due to public opinion. When the Medical Care Act of 1966 was passed, out of 97 Conservative and 9 Social Credit MPs, only two voted against it - many abstained or voted in favour. I don't think the GOP would act like this if universal healthcare were being passed in the US.

Your post misses slightly that historically, public opinion has been the main motivator for Canadian Conservatives to accept universal healthcare. Most Conservative voters in Canada would say they want to keep the universal healthcare system, in some cases with slight modifications, while most GOP voters in the USA would oppose a universal healthcare system in the first place.

2. I guess, but I would point out that Mulroney sided with Thatcher in the 1980s on the Montreal Protocol and phasing out CFCs to protect the ozone layer, while Reagan was more sceptical. You're right that Conservatives in Canada are generally pro oil and gas, but they haven't really hesitated to support pro-environmental policies (and I don't see pro-environment policies as being contradictory to right wing views - as I said, even Margaret Thatcher was in favour of a lot of pro-environment policies). The carbon tax is not a good comparison because it's not really a pertinent political issue in the US like it is in Canada. However, Schwarzenegger did implement cap and trade when he was a GOP Governor of California, so it can be argued that Canadian Conservatives are more right wing than that? But then again, even an Albertan Conservative government in the 2000s imposed a cap and a price on some GHG emissions.

3. Again, the trucker protests are not really a good comparison because there is no American equivalent of this.

4. Where did you get this from?

5. This is fair, and polling suggests that views on abortion are almost as varied in Canada as they are in the US.

One issue I'm surprised you didn't mention is immigration. Back in 2017 or so, Trump wanted to emulate the Canadian points system, and back then the Canadian immigration system was viewed as much more successful because it was run relatively well by the Harper government between 2006 and 2015. Also, Reagan gave amnesty to illegal immigrants in the 1980s - Mulroney actually made immigration laws stricter back then. It can be argued that in some respects Canadian Conservatives are more right wing on immigration.

- I do think the PC's were generally more moderate than the CPC so its hard to say how the CPC would have reacted if single payer was being introduced today.

- Reagan did back the Montreal Protocol though and also this is another issue where the CPC is clearly to the right of the old PC's . The CPC is far more a western conservative party which plays a huge role in this . Also I disagree on it not being as big of an issue here as the Democrats have proposed it before and the GOP does oppose it

- Well the point is both the GOP base and the CPC base tended to oppose COVID Vax Mandates, are increasingly distrusting of institutions, and not willing to just defer to experts. Keep in mind that Polievre is also now running on being anti WEF as well

- On of Polievre main pledges is to fire the gatekeepers and he has said he means that hed get rid of many bureaucratic positions

[Upper Canada Tory]

For starters, the Republican Party would have to move in the direction of conservative parties in Europe and/or Canada on a number of issues (i.e. supporting universal health care, accepting the scientific consensus on climate change, etc.).

The Canadian Tories aren’t really more moderate than the GOP:

1. The Canadian Tory party only support single payer because Left of center governments succeeded in implementing them. If LBJ was successful in passing Medicare for all on 1965, the GOP also would be pro single payer

2. The Canadian Tories are arguably to the right of the GOP on environmental issues . Keep in mind Stephen Harper was their prime minister for 10 years , being pro pipeline is one of their core issues for a while and currently eliminating the carbon taxes is one of their main promises so it’s false to say the Canadian Tories are really any much to the left of the GOP on environmental issue

3. The Canadian Tories are led by someone who supported the Trucker Protests , and the Alberta Tories are led by someone who passed a bill that lets her nullify certain federal laws .

4. The Canadian Tories are led by someone who wants to implement Trump’s schedule F plan but without replacing the civil service employees he plans to fire as he plans to eliminate those postions all together .

5. Even on abortion , the Tories only don’t support banning it because they did try to ban it in 1989 but their efforts failed .

Like the Polievre Canadian Tories aren’t really to the left of the GOP at all , and if you reversed both parties you really wouldn’t see much change in either as the only issues the Canadian Tories are more liberal on then the GOP(healthcare , and abortion), they are out of convience .


Even the UK Tories , they are to the right of the GOP on immigration, and arguably trans issues too though yeah they are more moderate on most of the issues .

1. This is somewhat debatable. At the provincial level, a lot of Conservative governments were in favour of implementing universal healthcare in the 1960s (eg, John Robarts in Ontario). They were initially against, but switched their stance due to public opinion. When the Medical Care Act of 1966 was passed, out of 97 Conservative and 9 Social Credit MPs, only two voted against it - many abstained or voted in favour. I don't think the GOP would act like this if universal healthcare were being passed in the US.

Your post misses slightly that historically, public opinion has been the main motivator for Canadian Conservatives to accept universal healthcare. Most Conservative voters in Canada would say they want to keep the universal healthcare system, in some cases with slight modifications, while most GOP voters in the USA would oppose a universal healthcare system in the first place.

2. I guess, but I would point out that Mulroney sided with Thatcher in the 1980s on the Montreal Protocol and phasing out CFCs to protect the ozone layer, while Reagan was more sceptical. You're right that Conservatives in Canada are generally pro oil and gas, but they haven't really hesitated to support pro-environmental policies (and I don't see pro-environment policies as being contradictory to right wing views - as I said, even Margaret Thatcher was in favour of a lot of pro-environment policies). The carbon tax is not a good comparison because it's not really a pertinent political issue in the US like it is in Canada. However, Schwarzenegger did implement cap and trade when he was a GOP Governor of California, so it can be argued that Canadian Conservatives are more right wing than that? But then again, even an Albertan Conservative government in the 2000s imposed a cap and a price on some GHG emissions.

3. Again, the trucker protests are not really a good comparison because there is no American equivalent of this.

4. Where did you get this from?

5. This is fair, and polling suggests that views on abortion are almost as varied in Canada as they are in the US.

One issue I'm surprised you didn't mention is immigration. Back in 2017 or so, Trump wanted to emulate the Canadian points system, and back then the Canadian immigration system was viewed as much more successful because it was run relatively well by the Harper government between 2006 and 2015. Also, Reagan gave amnesty to illegal immigrants in the 1980s - Mulroney actually made immigration laws stricter back then. It can be argued that in some respects Canadian Conservatives are more right wing on immigration.

- I do think the PC's were generally more moderate than the CPC so its hard to say how the CPC would have reacted if single payer was being introduced today.

- Reagan did back the Montreal Protocol though and also this is another issue where the CPC is clearly to the right of the old PC's . The CPC is far more a western conservative party which plays a huge role in this . Also I disagree on it not being as big of an issue here as the Democrats have proposed it before and the GOP does oppose it

- Well the point is both the GOP base and the CPC base tended to oppose COVID Vax Mandates, are increasingly distrusting of institutions, and not willing to just defer to experts. Keep in mind that Polievre is also now running on being anti WEF as well

- On of Polievre main pledges is to fire the gatekeepers and he has said he means that hed get rid of many bureaucratic positions

Something else that is probably worth adding re:environmental issues is, 1. Harper ran on a cap and trade system in 2008 (however, on the condition that the US implements one as well to avoid competitive disadvantages) and 2. O'Toole ran on something similar to a carbon tax in 2021.

Of course, they did this mostly to appeal to the general Canadian public, not the Tory base, but I doubt a GOP nominee would do this even to win over centrist voters.

Secondly, regarding COVID policy, Canadian Conservatives were surprisingly liberal on that issue. Alberta and Ontario under Ford and Kenney had stricter lockdowns than NDP-run BC and Alberta and Ontario did have vaccine passports. The CPC base's views on lockdowns/vax mandates is mixed but many were actually in favour.

[OSR stands with Israel]

For starters, the Republican Party would have to move in the direction of conservative parties in Europe and/or Canada on a number of issues (i.e. supporting universal health care, accepting the scientific consensus on climate change, etc.).

The Canadian Tories aren’t really more moderate than the GOP:

1. The Canadian Tory party only support single payer because Left of center governments succeeded in implementing them. If LBJ was successful in passing Medicare for all on 1965, the GOP also would be pro single payer

2. The Canadian Tories are arguably to the right of the GOP on environmental issues . Keep in mind Stephen Harper was their prime minister for 10 years , being pro pipeline is one of their core issues for a while and currently eliminating the carbon taxes is one of their main promises so it’s false to say the Canadian Tories are really any much to the left of the GOP on environmental issue

3. The Canadian Tories are led by someone who supported the Trucker Protests , and the Alberta Tories are led by someone who passed a bill that lets her nullify certain federal laws .

4. The Canadian Tories are led by someone who wants to implement Trump’s schedule F plan but without replacing the civil service employees he plans to fire as he plans to eliminate those postions all together .

5. Even on abortion , the Tories only don’t support banning it because they did try to ban it in 1989 but their efforts failed .

Like the Polievre Canadian Tories aren’t really to the left of the GOP at all , and if you reversed both parties you really wouldn’t see much change in either as the only issues the Canadian Tories are more liberal on then the GOP(healthcare , and abortion), they are out of convience .


Even the UK Tories , they are to the right of the GOP on immigration, and arguably trans issues too though yeah they are more moderate on most of the issues .

1. This is somewhat debatable. At the provincial level, a lot of Conservative governments were in favour of implementing universal healthcare in the 1960s (eg, John Robarts in Ontario). They were initially against, but switched their stance due to public opinion. When the Medical Care Act of 1966 was passed, out of 97 Conservative and 9 Social Credit MPs, only two voted against it - many abstained or voted in favour. I don't think the GOP would act like this if universal healthcare were being passed in the US.

Your post misses slightly that historically, public opinion has been the main motivator for Canadian Conservatives to accept universal healthcare. Most Conservative voters in Canada would say they want to keep the universal healthcare system, in some cases with slight modifications, while most GOP voters in the USA would oppose a universal healthcare system in the first place.

2. I guess, but I would point out that Mulroney sided with Thatcher in the 1980s on the Montreal Protocol and phasing out CFCs to protect the ozone layer, while Reagan was more sceptical. You're right that Conservatives in Canada are generally pro oil and gas, but they haven't really hesitated to support pro-environmental policies (and I don't see pro-environment policies as being contradictory to right wing views - as I said, even Margaret Thatcher was in favour of a lot of pro-environment policies). The carbon tax is not a good comparison because it's not really a pertinent political issue in the US like it is in Canada. However, Schwarzenegger did implement cap and trade when he was a GOP Governor of California, so it can be argued that Canadian Conservatives are more right wing than that? But then again, even an Albertan Conservative government in the 2000s imposed a cap and a price on some GHG emissions.

3. Again, the trucker protests are not really a good comparison because there is no American equivalent of this.

4. Where did you get this from?

5. This is fair, and polling suggests that views on abortion are almost as varied in Canada as they are in the US.

One issue I'm surprised you didn't mention is immigration. Back in 2017 or so, Trump wanted to emulate the Canadian points system, and back then the Canadian immigration system was viewed as much more successful because it was run relatively well by the Harper government between 2006 and 2015. Also, Reagan gave amnesty to illegal immigrants in the 1980s - Mulroney actually made immigration laws stricter back then. It can be argued that in some respects Canadian Conservatives are more right wing on immigration.

- I do think the PC's were generally more moderate than the CPC so its hard to say how the CPC would have reacted if single payer was being introduced today.

- Reagan did back the Montreal Protocol though and also this is another issue where the CPC is clearly to the right of the old PC's . The CPC is far more a western conservative party which plays a huge role in this . Also I disagree on it not being as big of an issue here as the Democrats have proposed it before and the GOP does oppose it

- Well the point is both the GOP base and the CPC base tended to oppose COVID Vax Mandates, are increasingly distrusting of institutions, and not willing to just defer to experts. Keep in mind that Polievre is also now running on being anti WEF as well

- On of Polievre main pledges is to fire the gatekeepers and he has said he means that hed get rid of many bureaucratic positions

Something else that is probably worth adding re:environmental issues is, 1. Harper ran on a cap and trade system in 2008 (however, on the condition that the Obama admin in the US implements one as well to avoid competitive disadvantages) and 2. O'Toole ran on something similar to a carbon tax in 2021.

Of course, they did this mostly to appeal to the general Canadian public, not the Tory base, but I doubt a GOP nominee would do this even to win over centrist voters.

Secondly, regarding COVID policy, Canadian Conservatives were surprisingly liberal on that issues. Alberta and Ontario under Ford and Kenney had stricter lockdowns than NDP-run BC and Alberta and Ontario did have vaccine passports. The CPC base's views on lockdowns/vax mandates is mixed but many were actually in favour.

I mean the Republicans ran on a cap and trade system in 2008 as well but the GOP like the CPC has moved right on the issue since then . A lot of this has very little to do with environmental issues but more for national security ones as the geopolitical situation has deteriorated greatly since then so North America does need to be Energy independent. I do agree Erin’s Tories were more moderate but they were also the most moderate iteration of the Tories by far since the merger and the Tories have moved back to the right since his ouster .

As for COVID , keep in mind that Alberta reopened schools before the vast majority of states did here
but yeah I do agree the Tories were more liberal than the GOP were here on that issue but again that was under Erin O Toole . The Trucker protest and the rise of Pierre Polievre and Danielle Smith showed the Tory based was far more opposed to COVID restrictions than people thought they were so I don’t think citing Erin’s Tories really is accurate here because Polievre has shifted the party significantly to the right

[Upper Canada Tory]

For starters, the Republican Party would have to move in the direction of conservative parties in Europe and/or Canada on a number of issues (i.e. supporting universal health care, accepting the scientific consensus on climate change, etc.).

The Canadian Tories aren’t really more moderate than the GOP:

1. The Canadian Tory party only support single payer because Left of center governments succeeded in implementing them. If LBJ was successful in passing Medicare for all on 1965, the GOP also would be pro single payer

2. The Canadian Tories are arguably to the right of the GOP on environmental issues . Keep in mind Stephen Harper was their prime minister for 10 years , being pro pipeline is one of their core issues for a while and currently eliminating the carbon taxes is one of their main promises so it’s false to say the Canadian Tories are really any much to the left of the GOP on environmental issue

3. The Canadian Tories are led by someone who supported the Trucker Protests , and the Alberta Tories are led by someone who passed a bill that lets her nullify certain federal laws .

4. The Canadian Tories are led by someone who wants to implement Trump’s schedule F plan but without replacing the civil service employees he plans to fire as he plans to eliminate those postions all together .

5. Even on abortion , the Tories only don’t support banning it because they did try to ban it in 1989 but their efforts failed .

Like the Polievre Canadian Tories aren’t really to the left of the GOP at all , and if you reversed both parties you really wouldn’t see much change in either as the only issues the Canadian Tories are more liberal on then the GOP(healthcare , and abortion), they are out of convience .


Even the UK Tories , they are to the right of the GOP on immigration, and arguably trans issues too though yeah they are more moderate on most of the issues .

1. This is somewhat debatable. At the provincial level, a lot of Conservative governments were in favour of implementing universal healthcare in the 1960s (eg, John Robarts in Ontario). They were initially against, but switched their stance due to public opinion. When the Medical Care Act of 1966 was passed, out of 97 Conservative and 9 Social Credit MPs, only two voted against it - many abstained or voted in favour. I don't think the GOP would act like this if universal healthcare were being passed in the US.

Your post misses slightly that historically, public opinion has been the main motivator for Canadian Conservatives to accept universal healthcare. Most Conservative voters in Canada would say they want to keep the universal healthcare system, in some cases with slight modifications, while most GOP voters in the USA would oppose a universal healthcare system in the first place.

2. I guess, but I would point out that Mulroney sided with Thatcher in the 1980s on the Montreal Protocol and phasing out CFCs to protect the ozone layer, while Reagan was more sceptical. You're right that Conservatives in Canada are generally pro oil and gas, but they haven't really hesitated to support pro-environmental policies (and I don't see pro-environment policies as being contradictory to right wing views - as I said, even Margaret Thatcher was in favour of a lot of pro-environment policies). The carbon tax is not a good comparison because it's not really a pertinent political issue in the US like it is in Canada. However, Schwarzenegger did implement cap and trade when he was a GOP Governor of California, so it can be argued that Canadian Conservatives are more right wing than that? But then again, even an Albertan Conservative government in the 2000s imposed a cap and a price on some GHG emissions.

3. Again, the trucker protests are not really a good comparison because there is no American equivalent of this.

4. Where did you get this from?

5. This is fair, and polling suggests that views on abortion are almost as varied in Canada as they are in the US.

One issue I'm surprised you didn't mention is immigration. Back in 2017 or so, Trump wanted to emulate the Canadian points system, and back then the Canadian immigration system was viewed as much more successful because it was run relatively well by the Harper government between 2006 and 2015. Also, Reagan gave amnesty to illegal immigrants in the 1980s - Mulroney actually made immigration laws stricter back then. It can be argued that in some respects Canadian Conservatives are more right wing on immigration.

- I do think the PC's were generally more moderate than the CPC so its hard to say how the CPC would have reacted if single payer was being introduced today.

- Reagan did back the Montreal Protocol though and also this is another issue where the CPC is clearly to the right of the old PC's . The CPC is far more a western conservative party which plays a huge role in this . Also I disagree on it not being as big of an issue here as the Democrats have proposed it before and the GOP does oppose it

- Well the point is both the GOP base and the CPC base tended to oppose COVID Vax Mandates, are increasingly distrusting of institutions, and not willing to just defer to experts. Keep in mind that Polievre is also now running on being anti WEF as well

- On of Polievre main pledges is to fire the gatekeepers and he has said he means that hed get rid of many bureaucratic positions

Something else that is probably worth adding re:environmental issues is, 1. Harper ran on a cap and trade system in 2008 (however, on the condition that the Obama admin in the US implements one as well to avoid competitive disadvantages) and 2. O'Toole ran on something similar to a carbon tax in 2021.

Of course, they did this mostly to appeal to the general Canadian public, not the Tory base, but I doubt a GOP nominee would do this even to win over centrist voters.

Secondly, regarding COVID policy, Canadian Conservatives were surprisingly liberal on that issues. Alberta and Ontario under Ford and Kenney had stricter lockdowns than NDP-run BC and Alberta and Ontario did have vaccine passports. The CPC base's views on lockdowns/vax mandates is mixed but many were actually in favour.

I mean the Republicans ran on a cap and trade system in 2008 as well but the GOP like the CPC has moved right on the issue since then . A lot of this has very little to do with environmental issues but more for national security ones as the geopolitical situation has deteriorated greatly since then so North America does need to be Energy independent. I do agree Erin’s Tories were more moderate but they were also the most moderate iteration of the Tories by far since the merger and the Tories have moved back to the right since his ouster .

As for COVID , keep in mind that Alberta reopened schools before the vast majority of states did here
but yeah I do agree the Tories were more liberal than the GOP were here on that issue but again that was under Erin O Toole . The Trucker protest and the rise of Pierre Polievre and Danielle Smith showed the Tory based was far more opposed to COVID restrictions than people thought they were so I don’t think citing Erin’s Tories really is accurate here because Polievre has shifted the party significantly to the right

Just to clarify, it was at the provincial level, so under Ford/Kenney, but maybe influenced by O'Toole's moderation. But otherwise, you're right that it has changed under Poilievre/Smith.

[Sheikh Scott Walker]

The only thing that could get me to vote for the Democratic party is them nominating someone further right than the Republican candidate. No candidate too far right for me to the point I'd prefer a dem would ever make it past the primary.