$1.5 Trillion GOP Tax Cut Thread

[Kingpoleon]

Yeah, a pure tax cut would be a bad idea. The US needs tax reform, and preferably revenue neutral tax reform (without extremely rosy growth predictions). We're probably still heading towards a corporate rate cut and a standard deduction increase without any offsets. Tax reform is death the moment Roy Moore (or his Democratic opponent) becomes senator, so they're desperate for anything they can call a victory.

So, do you think cutting taxes on the bottom two by 7.5% and on those in the third lowest making less than $60,000 by 5%, as well as cutting the bottom three corporate tax rates by, say, 7-8% would be enough? Of course, ideally we'd see a small federal sales tax to make up for it.

[Kingpoleon]

Won’t be on for long, but I thought I should note that if a 5% VAT would raise $1.8 trillion(which I saw in one source), a 17.5% VAT would raise $6.2 trillion, and even a 10% VAT would raise $3.6 trillion. At that rate, surely some way could be found to balance the budget.

[Kingpoleon]

If there is a big recession, it will be a problem with these tax cuts & will tie the hands of the next President & will probably make him fail. Deficits will cross 1-1.5T $ if the economy goes south & you can't raise corporate taxes from 20% because there will be monthly job losses & you can't push small businesses.

But you will require a massive stimulus & infra package to get the economy back in order. That will increase the deficit & debt by so much. And the GOP will keep hammering the Democrat. And the Democrat has to cut spending or raise taxes big to make up for that after stabilizing the economy.

Cutting taxes and raising spending help during a recession, as does cutting interest rates...

[Kingpoleon]

If they would keep the current rates, maybe cutting taxes by 2-3% on those making <$60,000, they would do a lot better. That said, by cutting the corporate tax rates but also eliminating deductions, they could make this revenue neutral.

[Kingpoleon]

Upper middle class is 90k-250k

Ok. Well if that were the case then for sure I would agree that this tax plan does lower taxes for this group.  My point about wealth transfers were mostly for people in the 500K levels and above between metropole and non-metropole regions.

Of course if you ask people in my neighborhood they will define upper middle class at 750K but I get different regions have different views on this.

Wow! In Arkansas, the top 1% is something like $200,000+. If you make >$90,000, you're in the richest 5%. So yeah, this "hurts" rich states like New York and Oregon.


That said, I think the current tax rates are appropriate. I agree with Senator Lankford absolutely here: let's stop cutting at taxes and raising military spending until we can close that deficit. Even a 5% value-added tax should close it absolutely.

It gives me every incentive to be reborn as a Rothschild or a Rockefeller. But what can you expect from a President who fits a Marxist stereotype of a capitalist pig?

Just to be clear, millionaires and billionaires are not getting a tax cut.

[Kingpoleon]

The vast majority of deductions are special interests at work, with a handful of exceptions. However, cutting the income tax rates is fiscally insane, and raising them is politically suicidal.  Cutting at deductions would be fine, though. That said, we really, really need to find a new way of raising money.

[Kingpoleon]

Upper middle class is 90k-250k

LMAO. Half of Americans make less than $30k per year; 71% less than $50k per year. To be in the literal Top 1%, all you need to do is earn $250k per year.

Your "upper middle class" figure basically applies to the top 10% of income earners minus the wealthiest 1%. There's nothing "middle" (and certainly not "median") about being in the top 10%.

And anybody who has a $500,000 house is f@%king rich, much less one million.

Inaccurate. Many homes in NoVA or even in southern VA cost this much for a small house. Also, I know folks who had like a 2 bedroom in SD and 500K would barely get you that out there. Home value, although somewhat indicative of overall income, is a wildly misleading indicator depending on the area of the country being discussed.

Just on the principle, a 500,000 home is about $1,500 a month on a 30 year mortgage. At the very least we are talking upper middle class. No one, who is lower middle class or working class can can afford that and anyone who does have one will more then likely lose it before they ever get close to paying it off.

Yeah... If you can afford a house double the income for the top one percent($500,000), esp. on a ten year mortgage, you are most certainly wealthy relative to the country as a whole.

[Kingpoleon]

Hey, I just found a tax plan when I was making something on Pastebin:

https://pastebin.com/napnpULm

Seems to have a bit of a... noticeable title, though.

[Kingpoleon]

Hey, I just found a tax plan when I was making something on Pastebin:

https://pastebin.com/napnpULm

Seems to have a bit of a... noticeable title, though.

Interesting that they apparently contemplated a federal sales tax. To replace corporate tax entirely?

Not sure. It’s an oddly worded memo, but I suspect the sales tax makes up for the tax cuts or something of the sort. I’m fairly certain they wouldn’t eliminate the corporate tax.

[Kingpoleon]

Republicans have to know that democrats will sell this as another health bill, right? "Take away peoples healthcare to give rich people tax cuts" is not going to be popular.

Wyden has already started calling it a healthcare bill.

It takes some real political ineptitude to be outmaneuvered by the Democratic Party.

Wyden has always been a step ahead of his peers. Until a GOP tax and budget plan reduces the deficit, without majorly cutting welfare, I can’t support any of it.

[Kingpoleon]

RIP Graduate Students, Research Programs, and Higher Education/Professionalization institutions in this country if this passes.

Music to the GOP's ears.

They want more racist uneducated hicks and less grad students. Please and thank you.

We don't take kindly to no fancy, high-falutin Yankee book-learnin'! - 2/3rds of the GOP

Never thought people would say things like this about the Republicans raising taxes on the rich.

They also need to use the "TAX RAISERS!" clubs to knock Costello and Meehan and Fitzpatrick too. I can almost see the suburban ship wreck in the distance

I can already smell the young suburban Democratic professionals .

But honestly, I don't think this tax plan will be the main cause of the coming suburban curbstomping (it's coming though ). Even most VA-10, IL-06 or NJ-07 voters would see a tax cut. The problem is that the media has been covering this as if everyone in a high tax state would pay more in taxes, which isn't true.

RIP Graduate Students, Research Programs, and Higher Education/Professionalization institutions in this country if this passes.

Music to the GOP's ears.

They want more racist uneducated hicks and less grad students. Please and thank you.

We don't take kindly to no fancy, high-falutin Yankee book-learnin'! - 2/3rds of the GOP

45% of Trump voters has a college degree tho.

Yeah, and a number of those voters are RINO Toms who think the GOP is something it isn't.

Not true. RINO Tom himself voted for Clinton, and every college educated Republican I know supports Trump on >85% of the issues.

[Kingpoleon]

Just a reminder: if you’re married and making under $260,000 annually, you get a tax cut or at least break even. Single and under $200,000, same deal.

I really don’t get why this is “cutting taxes for the millionaires and billionaires.”

[Kingpoleon]

I told you corporations were people.

Can I marry one?

No. As a peasant, you cannot marry such royalty.

[Kingpoleon]

Why can't they just do something smart like:

- Actually lower the tax rate and keep all deductions for those making $250,000 or less.
- Lower corporate tax rates to get them in line with the rest of the world but then close the loopholes so corporations actually have to pay the 20-25% tax rate.
- Eliminate the estate tax for the small farmers that can possibly get hit while raising it on wealthy estates.
-Jacking up taxes 20-30% for the top 1% and punishing hiding money in offshore accounts.

Everyone wins!

You don’t seriously believe that people should be taxed 60-70% of their income, do you?

[Kingpoleon]

A fiscal trigger is good, if it guarantees automatic release if revenue does not rise as projections show it would need to to recoup the loss in revenue within the years.

[Kingpoleon]

The motion by Sen. Wyden to return the bill to committee has failed on a 48-51 Vote.

Good to see Wyden pulling all the stops. A top rate of 27.5% or 29.5% wouldn’t be unreasonable for the corporate rate, but these deductions on income are sneaky nonsense. We really need a top rate of 42.5% to prevent any chance of this being revenue-deficit.

[Kingpoleon]

Angus' motion to instruct on keeping the bill deficit-neutral fails, 48-50.

Boooo!

[Kingpoleon]

The removal of Salt deductions would screw over alot of upper middle class families in high tax states. Im glad some progress is being made to lessen the blow.

But if that were your concern then I assume you would have opposed the Obamacare tax increase on income over 200K/250K. Because it is the same set of people. 

Being part of the top 5% does not make you part of the middle class, not even the upper middle.

At what level does the upper middle class end? $150,000? $100,000?