Opinion of Socialism

[politicus]

Freedom ideology or Horrible ideology or just too diverse to categorize?

Does it offer any real solutions to the problems we face today?

[politicus]

Are we talking about actual Socialism and not some American GOP boogeyman? Well in that case, then while some Socialist parties around the world are good, from an economic standpoint, it's hard not to see it as discredited.

Yes, the other thing is utterly uninteresting. Given that we cant have unlimited growth in the future for ecological reasons socialist economic thinking with an emphasis on distribution of resources and government planning may have a comeback at some point in the future.

[politicus]

Voted FI assuming we're talking about the principles behind it - public ownership, greater social equality, redistribution of wealth etc.

You are missing the most important part of the principle, democratic control of production which is probably the most Freedom part of the Ideology.

Are we talking about actual Socialism and not some American GOP boogeyman? Well in that case, then while some Socialist parties around the world are good, from an economic standpoint, it's hard not to see it as discredited.

Explain how democratic control of production is discredited?

If by 'democratic control' you mean central planning and/or abolition of private property...really? How is it not discredited?

Everyone (well, almost everyone) agrees central planning has been discredited, but a model with workers ownership - either alone or combined with community ownership (municipalities, cooperatives etc.) - has not. There are numerous potential problems with such a model, but since it hasn't been tried full scale in a whole society, you cant say it has been discredited.

[politicus]

...central planning and/or abolition of private property...really? How is it not discredited?

Conversely, how is it that private privilege and control of others through 'property' not discredited?  We see the carnage all around us.

Oh, that might be the biggest increase in public welfare and the greatest eradication of poverty the world has ever seen which is playing its tricks. I understand that might be discrediting from your point of view, since you like the poor to starve and get shot, but not to most people.

Politicus, that a model has never even been tried is not a major strike in its favour.

No, thats obvious. But you cant say that it has been discredited.

Elements of it has been implemented in Israel - espcially in the 50s and 60s.
The whole concept of a decentralised Socialist market economy is interesting. It is remarkable  that the Left has mostly stopped advocating an alternative to capitalism (as opposed to market economy) after the collapse of the Soviet model, without trying to develop viable alternatives. 

[politicus]

Like I said earlier there are numerous potential problems associated with the concept, like how to benefit from economy of scale without destroying the democratic element, how to fire unnecessary/redundant workers and how to compensate public employees, who doesnt directly "produce" anything, that can be sold on a market.
But it is still surprising, that so few left wingers are working with the development of an alternative economic model.

Anyway it would be interesting if you could elaborate a bit on your two points. Too much guess-work when you present them in such an ultra short form.

[politicus]

The "decentralized model of Socialist control" has been tried, most notably in Yugoslavia, and produced this crap:

The 'Yugo' was a good car, wormy, and more to the point it was anyway a near-exact copy of the Fiat 127, also a good car and the product of a capitalist economy:

Thats not at all what we are talking about here. Yugoslavia was not a democracy and its model was not market based (even if it did have some market elements).